Terran Build Orders

[Dwimmerlaik]

I'm working on creating a good build order (one that is okay against all three races/ one you'd use if you have several oponents, being different races, like in a free for all game or something...)... Well since I'm semi-noob nothin's been working to well, so can some one post a good build order (with when to atack, or anything else important to it aswell, like when to build...), or a replay were there is a good terran player using a non-anti-race specific tactic?

Thanks in advance (saves time that way I don't have to do it later )...

[Schwitzer]

I can't actually give you a build order that works against all three races, because you'll need to play differently against each race. Like, against Protoss you obviously go metal, and against Zerg you start with M&M.

If you're playing something like a FFA, the general strategy is to castle in and try to make an impenetrable base (hopefully nabbing an expo, too). I know this doesn't sound terribly strategic, but I tend to find FFA is all about making your base difficult to attack so players are inspired to attack someone who is less defended and intimidating. From your castle you develop whatever godly force you can think of and set out. Well... either that, or you ally with other players and be bad manner little turds, but that happens a lot too, apparently.

[Sambo83]

in ffa I play zerg and go 3 hatch before pool at nat and min only. If no one kills me, I win.

[MidnightGladius]

In FFA, defend yourself well and then get cloaked wraiths and harass. As a joke, pretend it isn't you (if there are other Terran players in the game). If they don't detect/notice the color, they might be provoked into attacking the other Terran player. Not much of a build order, but a tip, really.

[Schwitzer]

in ffa I play zerg and go 3 hatch before pool at nat and min only. If no one kills me, I win.
This would rape the general castle-and-tech strategy that most FFA players use. If you do it properly and - of course - don't get early rushed (which is unlikely as it would leave the rusher weak vs. the others).

[Sambo83]

I disagree with the other two posters. I don't think defense is good in FFA, (or any game). Early on, you need to try to expand, and then quickly take another hidden expansion. In FFA, if you are playing to win, you need to assume that your opponents are doing the same thing. All all out rush on you early on would leave them facing certain death by the other player. So you can assume that you won't be rushed immediately.

This would rape the general castle-and-tech strategy that most FFA players use. If you do it properly and - of course - don't get early rushed (which is unlikely as it would leave the rusher weak vs. the others). exactly. :) And you get a TON of speedling shortly after the pool finishes, so it's just a matter of not being attacked with their first units.

[MidnightGladius]

Assumptions are deadly. You ASSUME they won't rush you in NR games. Whaddya know, someone comes with a bunch on M&M 4 min into the game. Well, that was a bad example.

You remember that game where boxer hid his fleet of valks under a floating rax and owned his opponents mutas/guards when the other thought he had gone M&M&Tanks?

In any case, there is a distinct border between "castling" and "turtling" Turtling refers to having an "impenetrable" (which really means takes longer time to kill) base, usually done by making masses of static and mobile defenses.

Castling refers to making attacking you appear not worth it. This can be done in several ways, but intimidation is very useful.

In chess, the equivalent of turtling would be putting everything around your king (foolish, because it opens you up to all sorts of nasty tactics). The equivalent of castling would be...castling. It doesn't physically do much except enclose the king with the rook (and make early queen harass harder), but it has a nice psychological effect that shows both of you that thne game will be prolonged indefinately.

[Sambo83]

Assumptions are deadly. You ASSUME they won't rush you in NR games. Whaddya know, someone comes with a bunch on M&M 4 min into the game. Well, that was a bad example
Well.. if you are all out rushed in an FFA, you can call the guy an idiot because he just lost too. Since I only play with good players, I'm safe in assuming that one of them isn't going to do something that they know full well will cause them to lose.

[MidnightGladius]

What if you have to leave and put everything into killing off the guy who you hate the most?

[Sambo83]

Well then I don't have to worry, cuz I'm sure they'll go for your base and not mine.

[MidnightGladius]

Ok I give up on this. You win, Sambo. [Begins brainwashing self and changes FFA playing style]

[Cpt.Chronic]

Defense in a ffa is necessary because whenever you attack someone they're always like "omg green, you're so mean stop attacking me" which then notifies the other person that your main army is out of position to defend your base, so if you don't have a heftier defense than a normal 1v1 defense you're going to lose, or at least be set back substantially.

[Dwimmerlaik]

What do you normally do, if lets say in a FFA game you have one oponent of each race? (Also I know you go metal against toss, and M&M against zerg, but what against other terrans?)

[Spartan-II]

Anything that works.

[IceFlare]

in ffa I play zerg and go 3 hatch before pool at nat and min only. If no one kills me, I win.thanks for stating the obvious lol =P

[Valjean]

thanks for stating the obvious lol =P
I think he meant in an early rush. =/

[Dwimmerlaik]

...lol thanks for the help... (sarcasm to a certain extent)

[Schwitzer]

We helped you as much as we could, given the questions you were asking. What more do you want?

[Sambo83]

Dwimmer, real men play 1v1. If you want to improve, that's what you shoudl be playing

[Ahzz]

Sambo, come to b.net and play 1v1 with me T_T if u can, i mean

[Valjean]

but what against other terrans?
Basically, go tech/metal like with Toss.

[MidnightGladius]

What Werewolf said.

Just keep the expansions to yourself (Denying them to enemy and getting them for yourself, in the case you didn't know). Do this by tank cliffing, wraith harassing, M&M drops, tank pushes, or whatever you feel like doing.

[Dwimmerlaik]

Thanks for the help (actually ment seriosly)... (I was askin crappy questions... =) So against terran just go metal, like against toss?

[Schwitzer]

Essentially, yes...

[ReD_ICE]

i wouldn't recommend m+m drops...just go fully meca, cuz m+m gets blown to pieces by tanks, and if ur playing with a t, he's definitely gonna go with tanks. Save the money, and get something nice like tanks.

[ZeroCross]

In FFA, defend yourself well and then get cloaked wraiths and harass. As a joke, pretend it isn't you (if there are other Terran players in the game). If they don't detect/notice the color, they might be provoked into attacking the other Terran player. Not much of a build order, but a tip, really.
Or he can just look on the minimap and see the team color that wraith belonged too. (if it was detected in any case. If it was'nt detected, what the hell are you doing by not downsizing his SCVs for him?)

[MidnightGladius]

Since when did harassing not have to do with killing workers?

[AntiNeutrino411]

Exactly what MidnightGladius said. Dropping the opponent and wiping out the workers (in the early game) will take a lot of time to recover from, putting you way ahead in the resource battle. And the same reason above applies for expanding earlier because then you still have supplies coming from another base, even when your main base's workers are wiped out.

Or even better: Place a missle turret or two near your mining base and defend the ground with tanks in seige mode. Simple enough

[IceFlare]

there are certain instances wen having m+m is much better than going metal if your metal army isnt large enough or your losing the battle agsint a terran whos also going metal. the constant and automatic healing will serve u much better and since theyre small take 1/4 dmg from tanks

[Prozerran]

Terran Metal in the mirror simply leaves you with these options: 1) Tech with him and get to air as fast as you can to counter the Siege Tanks or 2) pump M&M plus Bats from 2 Rax and research stim packs. It's been a while for me, but the last time I checked, Stimmed Firebats were lethal against Terran Metal builds that bypassed infantry production altogether. And since when did we stop talking about containment and tank pushing? Is that no longer viable or something?

[ReD_ICE]

since when couldn't u harrass drop with vultures? it takes 3 hits to kill an scv, considering 4 in from a dropship, can take out the scvs just as quick as m+m's

all i said was m+m drops are not as reliable compared to metal drops in tvt

[Dwimmerlaik]

Right now my current build order is something like this:
-8th SCV build supply depot nar entrance (for a wall); when finnished build Barracks, followed by supply depot, followd by bunker, followed by supply depot, followed by waiting to repair
-9th SCV, scout once it has found enemy if they didn't start there refinery/asimilater/extracter yet build refinery on there's and cancel build before it finnishes, that way when it gets down to almost know health, I can cancel to gain back my recources; if not, I'd do whatever seems apropriate
-10th SCV build a refinery
-Nth* SCV Factory and add on machine shop; when finnished build Armory
-Factory; add on machine shop

*meh, whenver I have the recources from this point forward...

well, something like that anyway... ...exept when playing zerg... ...what do you think?

[ReD_ICE]

definitely more scvs...i usually get 1st fac on the 14th scv

[IceFlare]

its not set... against toss you get a fact as soon as u got the money to do so, regardless of wut scv ur on

[ReD_ICE]

yeah, but in tvt, 14 is probably a good number