Problem with Player 11

[Loser]

I'm trying to utilize players 9 - 11 in a map I'm making. However, they don't seem to respond when a player attacks them, even though I made triggers to set their ally status to enemy.

Is there anything I'm doing wrong or can players 9 - 11 not be used in a map like normal computer players?

[Durandal]

Players 9-11 do not have vision with themselves, and thus cannot attack back. That's why they just run and follow you when you shoot them.

I believe basic triggers can still be run on them if given a start location, with exception of AI scripts.

[Loser]

Players 9-11 do not have vision with themselves, and thus cannot attack back. That's why they just run and follow you when you shoot them.

I believe basic triggers can still be run on them if given a start location, with exception of AI scripts.

They don't run and follow me, they just stand there =/. But anyways, would it be possible to have them get an attack order (with the "Order" trigger) when a unit approaches them (have a location centered on them)?
Or is there a way to give them vision to themselves or another player?

EDIT: Hmm, doesn't seem to work...
I have an idea, maybe I'll have the units given to a player when an enemy approaches them, and then revert back to player 11 when the enemies die... hmm...

[Durandal]

Why so much complication? What are you trying to do with them?

[Loser]

Well, in my map (or well, our map, I have a partner as you know =D), 3 players play as the "heroes," 5 play as the bosses, and I needed 3 more to control the towns. The towns really don't do much other than defend themselves and label a bunch of locations.

So far I've managed to get the tutorial of one hero down, except for the target dummies are supposed to fight back.
Want me to link what I have of the map so far?

[Polkaman]

Sorry. Only you can attack them. Although i have seen instances where Player 9 has attacked me when i've attacked him...

[Durandal]

That's probably due to the fact that when you attack another unit that can't see you, there's a brief "flare" around your unit.

[ForTheSwarm]

Would it be possible to place map revealers for player 11?

[Polkaman]

Its possible, it wouldn't help though. At least i dont think so.

[BlademasterSlsh]

The trick is to find a way to share vision with Player 11, since it has no vision. That, or pick units that attack just right so that Player 11 can always attack back.

[Durandal]

The trick is to find a way to share vision with Player 11, since it has no vision. That, or pick units that attack just right so that Player 11 can always attack back.

If it were possible, you'd see it happening.

And since you don't, it's not.

[TheNomad]

I thought P9-P11 aren't available in multiplayer. Including triggers (since the start locations aren't used).

[Loser]

I know they can be in multiplayer, I've done a few test runs with blademaster that proves that they'll at least sit there for you, which is all I need them to do if I just have a system to where they go under the player's control temporarily when someone gets too close to them. As for the target dummies, I've just made them player 8 since player 8 is now a computer (I decided that the element of Time was too strong to be controlled by a player XD).

EDIT: Actually, players 9 - 11 will sometimes attack you for a second (sometimes when an enemy attacks you from somewhere you can't see, they appear for a second - that's happpening here), but it's not very reliable.

[ForTheSwarm]

Can't you place map revealers for player 11? Then they can see you.

[BlademasterSlsh]

Can't you place map revealers for player 11? Then they can see you.

The problem is player 11 doesn't have vision with itself. And since you cant share vision with them...

[ForTheSwarm]

Oh, now I get it.

[Durandal]

(sometimes when an enemy attacks you from somewhere you can't see, they appear for a second - that's happpening here)

Yeah, that's what I was trying to say here;

That's probably due to the fact that when you attack another unit that can't see you, there's a brief "flare" around your unit

I only ever see it work once, then the unit ceases. Then again, I never bothered to test it on anything stronger than infantry. It might be more effective if shooting it from a naturally obscured position, like a cliff top, then backing off for a moment and shooting it again.

[Loser]

Now for another question: When you're making hypertriggers, why do they tell you to make 3 triggers full of wait 0 milliseconds and a preserve trigger command? I've tried making it less than 3, and it doesn't seem to make any difference whatsoever how many wait commands you have. (I'm trying to make it slower. One of the heroes in my map, a tassadar, moves by moving an observer instead of himself. But without hypertriggers, the move commands are too slow, and with them, they're so fast that enemies can't damage him because he's constantly being moved.)

EDIT: Hmm, looks like there is a difference. Seems that the number of wait commands I need is somewhere between 10 and 16 =D.

[Twitch6000]

what you need to do then is,do like tuxlar did in his astro gears map.
Instead of wait0 *63 preserve.Do wait 75*63 and preserve copy 4 times and there you go.

[Loser]

Didn't work. He's still invulnerable. Hmm, let me try something else, I have an idea of another thing that might be causing it...
EDIT: Still doesn't work. I see the zealots attacking and the goons trying to attack but they aren't doing any damage. It's wierd.

EDITagain: Ok, I think I've found it. A single wait command of 110 seems to work perfectly =D. So far. I might need to adjust it a bit once I add more triggers.

How many heroes do you think I should have if there will be 3 people choosing them? So far I have two done but I'm running out of ideas faster than I thought I would.

[Polkaman]

5.

And instead of move, why dont you do order?

[Loser]

5.

And instead of move, why dont you do order?

... Because that would go against the entire idea of teleporting him to wherever the observer goes.

EDIT: Er, wait, 5 what? Wait commands? Milliseconds? Triggers?

[BlademasterSlsh]

Er, wait, 5 what? Wait commands? Milliseconds? Triggers?
Heros

My say, 6 heros. But we'll see how it comes along.

[Loser]

Ok, me will go with 6, will probably scap the idea of having a bc and arbiter hero lol =P. Hijaker (civilian who can take command of vehicles) probably won't work out either.

[Durandal]

The reason you have to copy the hyper triggers 3 times is this;

Another possible problem with this form of hyper trigger is the next ending occurence, or "NEO" for short, which is a moment where the hyper triggers lapse, and the normal 2 second cooldown between trigger cycles occurs. This can be mostly avoided by adding extra copies of the hyper trigger. NEO is explained below. To avoid a quick NEO there only needs to be three copies of the hyper trigger, any more is simply a waste of space.

The frequency of the NEO (in seconds) can be calculated by finding the power (number of copies of the hyper triggers) of the number of wait conditions in a single hyper trigger plus one, then by finding the product of the result and 0.084 (the speed of the hyper trigger cycle in milliseconds).

NEO = (x + 1)n * 0.084 seconds; x < 64, n > 0

In this example, I have 4 copies of hyper triggers with 62 waits per hyper trigger which will look like this:

[62][62][62][62]

[]=hyper trigger
62=# of wait actions

NEO = (62 + 1)4 * 0.084 seconds
NEO = 634 * 0.084 seconds
NEO = 15792161 * 0.084 seconds
NEO = 1323248.724 seconds

1323248.724 seconds is around 367.56909 hours, which is over two weeks of a grace period before the NEO comes around. Nobody in their right mindset will play a map for over two weeks straight, usually.

Or, to put it short, after a certain amount of the time it reaches a point where it ceases to cycle through the triggers at 11.9 times per second, and reverts back to the normal Starcraft cycle speed.

Hmm, looks like there is a difference. Seems that the number of wait commands I need is somewhere between 10 and 16 =D. Also, I do not recommend that at all. Keep the 62 or 63 hypers (Depends on whether you have a comment or not). You understand that hypers can be slowed down by simply adding time to the "Wait" commands? For instance, you could put put "wait '7' milliseconds" 63 times instead, up to a maximum of 168 milliseconds,.

[Loser]

Oh I feel like such an idiot now... why didn't I think of this earlier... well, I solved my probelm with Tetric the Thunderlord being invulnerable due to his move command =D.

I simply added a wait trigger so it would teleport him every second instead of every time it goes through the trigger =/.