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LordAhriman
06-19-2004, 9:24 PM
Here's a Diplomacy map I thought up, with a few new rules (only one major change, read about that later.) Now, as you probably well know, I am not the most experienced Diplo player, being currently in my first game; but I grasp the concept and flow of gameplay pretty well, having studied recorded games (yes, lots and lots of free time); tell me if there are any forseeable imbalances or confusions with this map and it's new rules.

I'd like to get an 'exhibition match' (I think that's what you call it) running soon, if that's possible (IE, when a slot is open and I get the specifics of how to GM.) I check here more than once daily, so I'll be more than able to make maps on time.

http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/1289/themostfinaloffinals.png

1400 - Diplomacy Variant by Tom Kirkpatrick, AKA Lord Ahriman

Kingdoms.

On the map, there are seven countries, each with their own territories and supply centers. NOTE: These are suggested nations, historically accurate to the year 1400.

Kingdom of France - Duchy of Normandy, Poitiers (F), Paris (A), Albi (A)

England - London (F), Devon, Wales, York (A), Lancaster (A)

Small States of the German Kingdom - German Kingdom (A), Fora, Tyrolia (A), Holstein (F)

Kingdom of Poland and Grand-Duchy of Lithuania - Poland (A), Moldovia (F), Mazovia (A), Lithuania

Kingdom of Castille - Galica, Navarre (A), Old Castille (A), Murcia (F)

Ottoman Sultanate of Rome - Naissus (A), Thessalonia, Nicomedia (F), Smyrna, Angora (A)

Union of Kalmar - Denmark (A), Norway, Sweden (F), Finland (A)


Rule Variations.

1. The countries on the map are only SUGGESTED territories; you have the option of creating your own nation, so long as every player agrees to do this as opposed to going with standard nations.

a. How do you do this? Pick six territories (at most) at any place on the map.
b. You must have, within these pieces of land, no more and no less than three supply centers.
c. This nation becomes your home turf; give it a name.
d. The final boundaries of your nation MUST have one neutral space between another player's territories. There is one exception: your territory is allowed to have one territory that directly borders with another nation's land.
d. The final boundaries of your nation must be reasonably interconnected; you can have bases in both England and France, for example, or Spain and Africa; however, you can't choose to have a base in Finland, one in Spain, and one in Turkey, or some selection of the like.
e. The nation selection is first come, first serve, once the game is full. After the game is started, however, there is a period of negotiations where players are allowed to iron out the details of who owns what. In this fashion, the only factor of diplomacy that had to do with luck (what nation you get) is turned into a factor of diplomatic skill.
f. At the start of the game, you build two armies and one fleet at your home supply centers; if your territories touch no land, you build all armies. Where you build the armies and fleet is your choice, provided it is on your previously selected supply centers.

2. If an army or fleet is in Granada or the Marinid Kingdom, it may pass to the other without having to enter and exit the Straits of Gibraltar. However, a fleet coming from the Western Mediterranian or North Atlantic must stop in the Straits of Gibraltar on it's route to either body of water. Optionally, the Straits of Gibraltar can be occupied in the same fashion as any body of water.

3. Flanders does touch both the English Channel and North Sea. Sicily does border directly on Naples.

4. Naissus and Moldovia do NOT share a border, no matter what the map looks like.

5. The Irish Sea acts though a permanant and neutral convoy unit were there: a unit in Wales can travel directly to Leinster, same as a unit in Ulster can travel to Scotland. No other body of water does this.

6. Corsica and Sardinia (otherwise known as Bella Rocca and Arborea) are considered part of Rome. Cyprus is a part of Karaman. Crete is a part of Athens.

7. The provision of North/South/East/West coasts is gone; Nicomedia, for example, touches the Black Sea, Aegean Sea, and Eastern Mediterranian.

8. All other rules of Diplomacy apply.

Maegtelluma
06-19-2004, 10:45 PM
I'm in. I'm going to be starting my first GM game soon, so i feel for you. You'll do fine.

Edit:
After a read over of the rules, i'm a little confused on a few points...

you get to basically set the position of your country?
if Naissus and Moldovia don't share a border, does Wallachia have a small coast (is it inhabitable by fleets?)

which bodies of water does Flanders touch?

I believe a slot for a game is open....probably a few slots since 1600, SEA and the other one all got closed.

Another question- does nicromedia have three different coasts?

-Maeg

LordAhriman
06-19-2004, 11:02 PM
Thanks Maeg :) I should have wrote it in, but I've done away with the north/south coast provision; you can now go black sea - nico - east med. All the rules besides # 1 were made to promote speed.

Yes, you get to choose all territories that would make up a country; say, for example, I wanted to own the Middle East; at start, I would choose Ilkhans, Jerusalem, Ramazan, Erzican, etc. Basically, you choose up to six territories as long as they are all in the same area and contain 3 supply centers.

Flanders touches the Channel and North Sea.

My GMing questions:
A. When an army is dislodged, the retreat order is given the next season, right?
B. How much time is a good amount of time between orders? Four days to me sounds a little excessive, but I'd like to know how much is too much on average.
C. Is a person allowed to send in order revisions before the map is drawn?

Maegtelluma
06-19-2004, 11:13 PM
Ok, i thought you said Flanders only touched one....nevermind

A. Usually, but some people just send it in between turns.
B. Its usually around there, but i think a ballpark of three days would be best.
C. GM preference, but almost always yes.

I have a question, who gets first dibs for country-making? How are we going to settle disputes over a territory?

And once we've made our country, can we pick unit locations?

-Maeg

LordAhriman
06-19-2004, 11:22 PM
Well, in my mind this would be the first stage of diplomacy, deciding who gets which territories. Seven players is the limit, and the map shows that it can do this with space left over.

Let me give a demonstration of the power of choosing territories (to all those interested)


Red likes Russia, so he chooses Novgorod, Rostov, Lithuania, Pskov, Golden Horde, and Cirassi.

Blue likes Greece, so he chooses Athens, Serbia, Thessalonia, Constantinople, and Naissus.

Teal likes Africa, so he chooses... etc. etc. etc.

At your supply centers, you build two armies and one fleet at the start; if your territories touch no land, you build all armies. Where you build the armies and fleet is your choice, provided it is on your chosen supply centers.

Maegtelluma
06-19-2004, 11:30 PM
Ok, so basically we should start thinking about what we want now. I like that idea, very original.

Would it be like a turn basis for choosing territories? Or is it first come first serve (:d :d :d)?

This could be really, really awesome, lol

Whiteknight
06-20-2004, 1:23 AM
I'm in.

I want:

Gran. - SC
Port.
Old. Castille.
Murcia.
Nava. - SC
Aragon. - SC

LordAhriman
06-20-2004, 1:49 AM
Well WK, aren't you the greedy one - every one of your selection is an SC :D I'm afraid you have to use the SC's that are already on the map - otherwise it would be impossible to balance it for neutral areas. There are a disproportionate amount of Spanish SC's anyway, so I'll make Portugal and Navarra non-SC's so you can be spain.

My selection:

Bretagne - SC
Poitiers - SC
Normandy
London - SC
Wales
Devon

I name myself The Grand Duchy of Bretanglany. WK, we'll need a name for your nation, anything at all.

Maeg, care to make your selection? Once you've done your selection I'll have a preliminary map ready to attact more people.

Map is now updated.

Whiteknight
06-20-2004, 1:57 AM
Then I change port to Marin, and Nava to Albi.

:p

EDIT: Wait. Changage.

Gran
Mur
Ara - SC
Old - SC
Mar - SC
Nava

Okay, do you want to limit it to three SC per person then?

LordAhriman
06-20-2004, 1:58 AM
If anyone has trouble with the rules - yes, they're very complex - ask.

Yes, 3 SC per person, and a max of three non-sc's. I believe I wrote that up, if I didn't I'll get cracking.

[EDIT] I've decided it's better to allow people to decide which territories they'd like to be SC's within their nation. WK, give a name to your nation, or I'll be forced to call it WhiteKnightia or something equally foolish :D

Current Standings:

Grand Duchy of Bretanglany - Lord Ahriman
London - SC
Wales
Devon
Normandy
Bretagne - SC
Poitiers - SC

? - WhiteKnight
Navarre
Old Castille - SC
Aragon - SC
Marinid Kingdom - SC
Granada
Murcia

STILL VERY VERY MUCH OPEN. Get in here people. :D

Whiteknight
06-20-2004, 2:00 AM
If you want to limit it to three, then here is my countries:

Ara
Gran
Old
Port
Nava
Gal

There are only 3 SC centres in that.

OboeGuru
06-20-2004, 2:09 AM
I'm in and desire:

Teut. Order (army)
Mazov. (army)
Pskov
Lithuania
Riazan
Golden Horde (fleet)

Sort of an adjusted Poland/Lithuania...

I'd like to call it Geldora. Don't ask.

Whiteknight
06-20-2004, 2:14 AM
Oops, forgot that.

Old: Army
Gran: Fleet
Ara: Army

My kingdom is called "The Kingdom of Canad"

LordAhriman
06-20-2004, 2:24 AM
Grand Duchy of Bretanglany - Lord Ahriman
London - SC (A)
Wales
Devon
Normandy
Bretagne - SC (F)
Poitiers - SC (A)

The Kingdom of Canad - WhiteKnight
Aragon - SC (A)
Granada - SC (F)
Old Castille - SC (A)
Port - SC
Navarra
Galicia

Geldora - Oboeguru
Teutonic Order - SC (A)
Mazovia - SC (A)
Pskov
Lithuania
Riazan
Golden Horde - SC (F)

The Southern Kingdom - Maegtulluma
Milan - SC (A)
Rome - SC (F)
Austria - SC (A)
Venice
Naples
Bosnia

PLEASE NOTE: THIS IMAGE IN THIS REPLY WILL BE USED TO MAP KINGDOMS ALREADY MADE AND WILL CHANGE AS NEGOTIATED OR DECLARED UNTIL THE START OF THE GAME. THE GAME IS STILL VERY MUCH OPEN.

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/7941/BEGINNING.png

Maegtelluma
06-20-2004, 9:20 AM
wow that was confusing, edited....

here's my choice anyway....

Milan (Army)
Rome (Fleet)
Austria (Army)
Venice
Bosnia
Naples

LordAhriman
06-20-2004, 12:59 PM
Any more takers?

Maegtelluma
06-20-2004, 7:10 PM
Oops, forgot the name

The Southern Kingdom

Subjukator
06-21-2004, 12:50 PM
I'd love to play but the computer I use at home has become very, very broken. Maybe in a week :(

LordAhriman
06-21-2004, 4:51 PM
Perhaps this was just a bit before it's time. Game postponed until some others finish.

Maegtelluma
06-21-2004, 5:19 PM
Ok, but don't you go cancelling this for good! I like the idea of choosing your own "country", and i'd like to see how well it works. I'm sensing a potential end in Modern Diplo, WK hasn't updated his map in a few weeks, and then there's Modreds and Oro's. You'll have some time coming up soon.

Cygnus
06-30-2004, 8:30 AM
Count me in!

Let's see... a good position.

Scot. SC (Army)
Norway
Sweden SC (Fleet)
Den. SC (Army)
Meck
Freis

Then the name:

The Holy Empire of the Norseman

Our mission is simple, to unite the world in Asgard's image

Oh, I also have a solution to your problem: Don't make the Irish sea act like a permanent convoy. Simply put a land bridge between Scot and Ulster

Maegtelluma
06-30-2004, 12:38 PM
This game is delayed until further spots open, you might have to wait a little while :)

Cygnus
06-30-2004, 1:22 PM
No problem, I can wait.

Cygnus
07-07-2004, 8:31 AM
*poke*

Or is it a bit dead?

Maegtelluma
07-09-2004, 5:28 PM
Delayed for a while. Not dead, just ignored until further notice :)

Cygnus
07-09-2004, 6:01 PM
*shrugs* Probably due to the limit on games right?

OboeGuru
07-09-2004, 6:26 PM
Actually, this game should go on the queue before Yamamoto's...

Maegtelluma
07-09-2004, 6:34 PM
Yeah.....is that why his is locked or just because of the nature of the game?

Cygnus
07-09-2004, 6:36 PM
Maybe a little of both?

LordAhriman
07-10-2004, 11:43 AM
Close this game, I've invented a new set of rules and a board - I'll open up a new one as soon as I'm finished with the games I'm playing.