Terran Military

[JTGizmo]

Hi all,

There is one thing I allways wondered. How are Terran Soldiers made, what I mean is - are they cloned or is manpower optained via birth? reason why i ask is cause due to history of star craft when the dominion was created no greater than 50k population survived on the biggest ship ( read up in wiki for details) and now with best of human abilities it would still take AT least 20 years or so to get first generation of fully developed fighter (plus the ones from original pop) . However they die like flys , buy thousands, what im trying to say is if its natural man power then in no way couldve they sustained or reporduce such man power to conquest the plants or battle for them . Any thoughts?

[Protogod]

This belongs int the starcraft forum, not in the sc2 forum.

And yes, all terran soldiers are natural-born. The terrans have been in koprulu for a long long time. You're whole "zomg it'd take 20 years" argument is irrelevant, because the terran have been there for far longer than 20 years.

[masterofhobbiton]

Yeah, agreed with protogod, same's true of protoss too.

Terran Militia forces are trained just like armies now, but confederate marines are mostly various criminals who are lobotomized and have their memories overwritten to tone down violence and make them more obedient. Then they are trained normally. In the 3rd SC book (the pretty bad one) you learn that in fact the confeds are running low on troops and actually raid small colony worlds for the physically fit and 'resocialize' them as well, making the main character believe that his town was raided by zerg who killed his girlfriend and he barely escaped, thus making him want to fight the zerg. They're just trained like normal people though, not cloned.

[SilverCrusader]

Terrans are weak, they have to have people to keep on fighting...
The Zerg can make endless swarms easily because they reproduce immensely fast.
The Protoss make robotic machinery that has really good AI and fights for them... probes, reavers, observers, and shuttles. Mostly they are support units... but in SCII the colluses are robotic combat units

[JTGizmo]

But thats impossible


This is taken from :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StarCraft_universe


However, the dynamic scientist Doran Routhe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minor_characters_in_the_StarCraft_universe #Routhe.2C_Doran) wanted to explore deep space (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_space). It was very risky, but he had no problem with sending political prisoner lab rats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lab_rat) to their deaths; 56,000 prisoners were secretly prepared for transport. Of these, 40,000 were loaded into four sleeper-ships (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Sleeper-ship&action=edit)Reagan, the Argo, the Sarengo, and the Nagglfar designated the . These were sent on a 1 year journey into deep space to Gantris VI, an outlying planet. The Nagglfar was also equipped with an artificial intelligence called ATLAS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATLAS_%28StarCraft%29). Routhe believed they would set up a colony and mine new resources for the United Powers League (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Powers_League).
ATLAS scanned the prisoners, and discovered something unusual about them - a high proportion of them had a mutation leading to psionic potential. While currently weak, it would manifest in only a few generations. This information was logged and sent back to Earth. This may explain how the United Powers League (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Powers_League) came to know of this experiment.
However, the guidance computer failed, and they traveled at faster than light speed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light_speed) for 28 years, traveling 60,000 light years to the far edge of the galaxy, emerging in a habitable star system with a large number of wasteland planets. When they awoke, the survivors had no idea where they were or where Earth was: all hope of making contact again was lost.

The Sarengo crashed on Umoja (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umoja_%28StarCraft%29), killing 8,000 prisoners; the Reagan, which landed softly, founded the colony of Umoja; the Argo founded the colony of Moria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moria_%28StarCraft%29); and the Nagglfar built the main Terran colony in the sector: Tarsonis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarsonis).


This means that only 32 thousand survived when they landed and they all landed in 3 diff locations thus roughly 10 thousand per place. now it took them 60 years to advance in a way to make contact with each other, but 60 years is not nearly enough for 10 thousand people to populate an army that can take on conquring other planets as well fighting other races. its humanly impossible to produce so many offsprings. Taking into account that out of those 10k not all were females... can you see what I mean....

[TitanWing]

And without birth control, abortions and a lot of horny criminals you got an army pretty fast.

[LordBafford]

It's a game, it doesn't have to make sense all the time. I mean they are traveling through space to other galaxies is enough to question. Who's to say they don't have some type of chemical or science to accelerate the human growth cycle.

[TitanWing]

Well...they're still in the Milky Way galaxy, just another part of it.

[JTGizmo]

And without birth control, abortions and a lot of horny criminals you got an army pretty fast.


that wouldnt be enough to populate the army to conqure other plants and fight other races, especially if they die like flies.

and thats why I was wondering how r they made and why i think its cloned or some rapid growth....

after all it is 23rd century.

[TitanWing]

Threre's never been any mention of cloning or growth acceleration. That was Star Wars.

[Protogod]

Threre's never been any mention of cloning or growth acceleration. That was Star Wars.

Yes. Not to mention that ATLAS contained a substancial cache of useful data. That means they could probably make even more ships and travel to other planets already. So having 10k on each planet doesnt really matter, since they can visit each other. Interplanetary whores...mmmmmm.......

[Mattimeeleo]

after all it is 23rd century.


You are right... think about it... just in the past 50 years. We advanced in tech a lot. By the past 100 years.... It's like day and night... We are totally different and more advanced than 100 years ago. Even in the 50's... They predicted the 21st century people to be only advance as the 60's.

[JTGizmo]

Yes. Not to mention that ATLAS contained a substancial cache of useful data. That means they could probably make even more ships and travel to other planets already. So having 10k on each planet doesnt really matter, since they can visit each other. Interplanetary whores...mmmmmm.......


will you read up on the link! - it took them 60 years before they came up a way to interact with each other and once they ,made contact with each other they started fighting with each other...

[Protogod]

will you read up on the link! - it took them 60 years before they came up a way to interact with each other and once they ,made contact with each other they started fighting with each other...

after 60 they found each other. Then they began founding colonies and all th like. War, etc. 13 COLONY PLANETS in the 25th century.

I think having 13 colony planets would = a good source of troops.

[U-238]

Alright here's the truth...

Marines are made in a barracks. They start out as a small, blue tube that gets filled by little green blocks. All this time the barracks is flashing like it's trying to stop a freight train. When the little tube gets filled up with green blocks it dissapears and a leaves behind a marine standing outside the now dormant barracks asking the rock in front of him if he wants a peice of him. (Which explains why they die like flys)

There happy?

[DarkMirror]

lol.
+rep.

[JTGizmo]

this is why i wanted to this thread to be in sc2 section, this here just seem a piss pool - cant even have a decent discussion

[DarkMirror]

Dude, theres no real conversation about this. No cloning, its just recruitment. We can breed like mice if we want. Look at africa.

[Protogod]

this is why i wanted to this thread to be in sc2 section, this here just seem a piss pool - cant even have a decent discussion

Rofl, what do you expect? it was a stupid question that only takes 1 post to answer.

[TitanWing]

/me agrees with the two above posts

[sdbolts11]

Alright here's the truth...

Marines are made in a barracks. They start out as a small, blue tube that gets filled by little green blocks. All this time the barracks is flashing like it's trying to stop a freight train. When the little tube gets filled up with green blocks it dissapears and a leaves behind a marine standing outside the now dormant barracks asking the rock in front of him if he wants a peice of him. (Which explains why they die like flys)

There happy?
ROFLMEYER!! NICE!!

[Tael_Zenith]

U-238 Wins.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but in the last 40-50 years, the population of earth went from 2 Billion to nearly 7 billion. Populations increase exponentially, and thats even with major population centers like China limiting births.

Starcraft doesn't have that great of a population but even with a population of 6-7 billion, our armies doesn't even add up to 100 million.

Say the Koruplu has 150,000 Citizens. If you dont fight, you die. thats a free 100,000 at least right there. Their existence is on the line, its not an overseas war, its a war in your front yard.

[apostolos]

you have a point
+rep

[JTGizmo]

U-238 Wins.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but in the last 40-50 years, the population of earth went from 2 Billion to nearly 7 billion. Populations increase exponentially, and thats even with major population centers like China limiting births.

Starcraft doesn't have that great of a population but even with a population of 6-7 billion, our armies doesn't even add up to 100 million.

Say the Koruplu has 150,000 Citizens. If you dont fight, you die. thats a free 100,000 at least right there. Their existence is on the line, its not an overseas war, its a war in your front yard.


your missing the fact that earth had 2 billion people to populate from to 7 billion and it took 100 years not 40-50.

But in starcraft story they had around 10 000 per planet/colony - that 10 thousand is if they were lucky and half of them had to be women to give birth so thats 5 thousand, and within 60 years u cant get 150 000 population thats is in fighting capability to colonize other planets and fight other races. thats why I think they were mix of clones and criminals . besides 150 000 wouldnt really last long with the rate terrans die...

[Protogod]

thats why I think they were mix of clones and criminals .

It's a pity you're wrong. Its a game, and blizzard writes the story. If you dont buy it, then tough cookies (http://www.cookuk.co.uk/images/chocolate-cookies/chocolate-cookies4-big.jpg)

[Skullflower]

Dude, theres no real conversation about this. No cloning, its just recruitment. We can breed like mice if we want. Look at africa.

It's all about China. Dont they have like, 1/6th of the world's population?

[Fiendwurm]

yep

also the in starcraft the human race has evoled drasteckly becuse of genetic implants(look at ghosts) so its possible that maturaty comes sooner + i wouldn't be suprised if the confederates enslaved lots of woman and use them for breeding

[Protogod]

i wouldn't be suprised if the confederates enslaved lots of woman and use them for breeding

ooa, kinky ;)

[U-238]

oh I can see it now.

"You.
Woman.
Sex.
NOW!"

[Protogod]

oh I can see it now.

"You.
Woman.
Sex.
NOW!"

not to mention "I want that one!"

[ryuugaki]

Sorry if I'm posting a little late, I read the first page and blew past the rest:

The story states that the Protoss encounter happened quite a bit after the Terrans landed, giving them plenty of time to breed like mice.

[Kimera757]

Terrans got two hundred years, and a lot of empty worlds, although they spent sixty of those years just developing regular space flight.

[Veeger]

Cloning? LOL. Do you just not pay attention? Move your cursor over any of the barracks options (marine/firebat/ghost/medic). It says "train" not "clone" or "make". The time and expense of terran infantry is training materials. Not to "make" them.

That is still mommy and daddy's job.

[Ktan]

It could be argued, from the SC II preview, that all that time to 'make' or 'train' the marine is the time it takes to put the armour on the marine, if that's the process that's followed in SC canon.

In which case, they have an ample supply of men, it's just getting them all armoured and kitted up in time. It would also explain why the training time is less than a year :P

[DarkLStrike]

they dont have a lot of men, considering they only have 200years to breed and only 50,000 to start with. I think, in the best circumstances, they'd have a million or two. And not all of them can be soldiers because armors need to be made, food need to be farmed, researches need to be done, etc.

[Veeger]

and we're arguing this why? How can Harry Potter cast spells from a stick? How could Sauron still be alive after 3000 years of being dead? How could the Overmind actually threaten the entirety of Protoss military might?

Who cares? Just enjoy the game.

[TitanWing]

Veeger's right. Playing SC is far more fun that arguing about why the Terrans aren't extinct yet.

[West]

the terrans aren't extinct/dead w/e yet cause blizzard still needs them to
play an important role in SCII .
....
lol that would be funny if all terrans die in SCII

[Kimera757]

The destruction of Korhal killed four million people, according to the manual (35 million in the novels). Tarsonis had a much bigger population. I don't think a population of "a few million" is all that realistic; they had a lot more.

[DarkLStrike]

The destruction of Korhal killed four million people, according to the manual (35 million in the novels). Tarsonis had a much bigger population. I don't think a population of "a few million" is all that realistic; they had a lot more.

How could they have more than a few million if they only had 50,000 to start with? According to you, they have at least 100million people put together, thats impossible. "a few million" is more realistic than more than 100million.

[TitanWing]

Not according to him, according the the books.

[Ktan]

The human race has exploded by about 1-2 billion between 1900 and 2000 (in RL).

That's how :P

[DarkLStrike]

The human race has exploded by about 1-2 billion between 1900 and 2000 (in RL).

That's how :P

Heh, since we have 7billion people now, I'm assuming, according to you, there's 5-6billion people around 1900. 100 years from 5-6billion people to 7billion isn't rare. Ratio wise, thats only about 20%+ Increase. However, a 200000% increase (50k to 100million) in 200years is just not possible without messing with the genetics and/or cloning.

[Ktan]

Fair point.

I suppose Blizzard are bad with either numbers or timelines.

[Kimera757]

Sci Fi Writers have no sense of scale (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main.SciFiWritersHaveNoSenseOfScale).

Humans could expand faster in the Koprulu Sector than on Earth, however, since the K-Sector was chock full of uninhabited planets. Someone want to look at how quickly the United States population grew? I think that's a better example.

[DarkLStrike]

its not about empty planets, it's about the reproduction rate of humans. Since its in the future, they probably marry older (since they live longer) and have a longer courting (dating) stage before having a child. Even given the best situation possible, a population can only grow so much.

[Protogod]

its not about empty planets, it's about the reproduction rate of humans. Since its in the future, they probably marry older (since they live longer)

who said they live longer? Terrans drop like flies.

[DarkLStrike]

Live longer as in the longevity of the terrans. I'm sure they'll die of old age later than we do.

[DarkMirror]

Yeah, what with stimpacks, high draft ratings, and constant gang wars...

[TitanWing]

And improved medical technology.

It depends on where you live.

[vIsitor]

Mind you, the Koprulu Terrans are the descendants of those Doran Ruthe spared from the UPL's "Project Purification". The first colonists consisted mainly of Cyborgs, Psychics, and the Genetically Enhanced, which had become commonplace before the UPL's ascendance. As a general rule, dissidents who were merely ordinary humans didn't measure up to Mr. Ruthe's standards, considering that he wanted the colonists to survive, and so I imagine that among those sent they were in the minority.

With this in mind, it is perfectly natural to assume that the rate of human reproduction and growth were greatly accelerated within the Koprulu Terrans' gene-pool. (Mind you, Duke was in active service since before he was 13!)

[clone98]

it's still possible, however. Another thought to put into focus is to consider the current birth/death rate of Earth, it's something like 2/3 born for every person to die, plus the Terrans have a bunch of worlds to work with, plus they probably have some way to make people grow faster, clones isn't out of the question.

But then again... who cares? It's video game, by definition, not realistic...

[DarkLStrike]

My point proven, marines are either made by cloning or they (or their parents) have been genetically altered in such a way to make them mature faster and reproduce more.

[KillerKow]

It's not absurd for a 200000% growth over 200 years. They're not on Earth; their years are different than ours. Maybe one 'year' for them is 1200 of ours. Think, guys.

[DarkLStrike]

uh. It doesn't matter. Just because the planet turns slower doesn't mean they can live longer.

[KillerKow]

No, but it gives more time for their population to grow. I think you entirely missed the point of my post.

[DarkLStrike]

but the mar sara conflict started on year 2499 or something like so. I dont think a rational human being would combine, say, tarsonisian years with earth years, its two completely different measurements of time. In order for your theory to be valid, it would say 2349 EY + 150 TY, as the date for the mar sara incident.

[SolidSamurai]

that wouldnt be enough to populate the army to conqure other plants and fight other races, especially if they die like flies.

and thats why I was wondering how r they made and why i think its cloned or some rapid growth....

after all it is 23rd century.

O snap. Correction time: It's actually the beginning the 26th century when you begin the game. That's over a century 60k light years away from earth. Wiki doesn't provide nearly enough info on this. I should write a fan fiction myself. :P

EDIT: BTW, UPL reformed into UED AFTER they discovered the alien presence.

Additionally, Tarsonis is larger then Earth. A revolution is around 28 hours or so on earth. Earth measurements still exist however, due to the fact that the terran maintained all there knowledge from the ATLAS onboard supercomputer.

[KillerKow]

Well, time is relative... >>

[Kimera757]

The StarCraft universe uses "real years". There are lots of worlds, so obviously each one is going to have a different year length. They would have standardized them to Earth time, to keep things simple.

marines are either made by cloning or they (or their parents) have been genetically altered in such a way to make them mature faster and reproduce more.

Most of the Marines were criminals, so they weren't clones. You don't come out of a cloning vat a crook. Maybe all the Terrans modified themselves to grow faster, but personally I doubt that, and in any event that would apply to all Terrans, not just Marines. Humans can breed very quickly under certain circumstances (not found in first world nations nowadays), and I don't believe I've seen evidence that the Terrans have small families.

[KillerKow]

Well, I think we can all at least agree that Blizzard simply didn't give us enough details for us to come to a realistic conclusion on the matter...

[DarkLStrike]

Most of the Marines were criminals, so they weren't clones. You don't come out of a cloning vat a crook. Maybe all the Terrans modified themselves to grow faster, but personally I doubt that, and in any event that would apply to all Terrans, not just Marines. Humans can breed very quickly under certain circumstances (not found in first world nations nowadays), and I don't believe I've seen evidence that the Terrans have small families.

as quick as they may be, 200000% increase in 200 years is still far stretched.