Information and Nuances of a DT rush

[TheBlackAbyss]

I've been seeing a steady increase in my own skill through practice. I've beaten some of the "less revered" members of swbk (For lack of a better term) Such as Titan Wing, Zeak, among a few others. I'm currently practicing with Sharp to improve.

I've noticed that against most mid skilled T's, they realize I'm going Protoss and tech quickly to metal, and forget to get turrents after e-bay and don’t have a comsat because they didn’t get Academy. I take advantage of that and default too a B/o I saw on Wikibooks, about a two gate DT build. Its fast enough, and I’ve beaten a number of terrans at my skill level without a problem. About a 75%-25% ratio of win/loss.

I usually have 2 DT’s and 3 zealots when I move out at first, from 2 gates. After the initial rush, I have a 3rd gate coming and zealot leg enhancements on the way, as well as two more DT’s.

I’m wondering this. What are some DT tricks? Some things to keep in mind about Micro and control with them? What can you, or do you do if a DT rush is thwarted? When should you expo on this build?

Thanks in advance, The Black Abyss.

[Cpt.Chronic]

First off, your build sounds like it sucks, no offense. Going dt's and zealots can easily be beat by just a single type of unit-- vultures. You should go goon into dt.

One key thing is to be sure not to let terran see your citadel or templar archives building. Also, if there's a scout in your base, you could fake going fast robo bay and once you kill the scout cancel it and switch to dt tech. Or you might want to try a dt drop because that way you can get around mines which are usually at the terran choke, and is usually where the first turret is built.

Once you have dt's, kill turrets first (duh), then go for scvs. If he has his turrets defended near his minerals, attack buildings that are away from turrets like supply depots or factories. You can put a dt on hold-position at his natural expo to stall him from expoing while you expo yourself.

Send DT's in one a time to start, that way they can remove mines without it splashing all your DT's.

If you have a shuttle, and he has a scanner, pick up dts with shuttle as soon as he scans. Also, if it's a bit later and you have obs that sees he has units near a minefield, drop the dt near the units to draw the mines' splash fire to them.

[lammas]

if your into dt rushing why to do 3zeal style when you can do basic dt rush build with proxy gate?

[Cpt.Chronic]

Yeah, proxy dt rush is good unless it's scouted. Then there is like 80% chance you lose, whereas if your dt rush is scouted without a proxy, you don't lose near as much ground.

[TheBlackAbyss]

Goons into DT's; thanks, thats something I'll do. I'll keep the shuttle info in mind, although I'm not sure I'll use it often. Not yet anyways. And. with the proxxy gate, I've tried a few times and only pulled success once or twice. Being where I am, I'm more comftorable building two gates in my own base.

[WickedImposter]

ya. if they have even 1 turret, your 3 zlot 2 dt rsuh will be stopped extremely easily.

[TheBlackAbyss]

Thats when I use the zlots as distraction and send the DT's past; think about turrents, is they're not mobile, and 2 DT's can do a good chunk of damage in a very short time.

[DragonPraetor]

So... Got your wooden modem working to paly some people? Just kidding! :)

Anyway, DTs work extrememly good as sentries if you want to keep someone from their expo or if you don't have obs but still want DT firepower. If your opponent is noob-average, they'll turret push down their hill to their expo to make you GTFO. Otherwise, they'll get an academy and scan you... Either way, you know they're expoing.

Another trick that's good to do is have a DT army at their choke, maybe 5 of them... Now this works two ways, but I like the latter.

1) You make them bring turrets or comsat to push out of their own base
2) You flank them after thwarting any attack or harass when your enemy retreats, the DTs make short work of almost any hurt unit.

I've had both happen to me, but the 2nd one had WAAAAAAY more success.

[WickedImposter]

lol. another great strat. post your dt in terrans cc place on expo. thatll deley their expo greatly, and force them to use a comsat. at the very least. you can also use rekruls wall, but only if they dont have turrets at their choke.

[Basan]

Anyone forgetting the ComSat? Almost every Terrans I know have it to ease their (long distance) scouting, so they can have it with a lil' power stored to prevent DT harass... as they usually do (when they don't see that much action from the 'Toss part).

[WickedImposter]

ya, but, comsat is limited by energy. and, if they see you scan they can just run out of way and wait until it wears down.

[DragonPraetor]

Turrets are a permanent field of non-cloakage... Comsat's only work for so long.

[blupp74]

Turrets are a permanent field of non-cloakage... Comsat's only work for so long.

Both turret and comsat has pros and cons.

Comsat Pro:
- Scan anywhere. Über mobility ftw.
- No risk of units/buildings getting killed.

Comsat Con:
- Requires energy (but once you have +2 expansions with comsat, you usually have all the comsat u need).
- Does not attack.

Turret Pro:
- Unlimited timeperiod of detection (until it gets killed)
- Can attack air

Turret Con:
- Not very mobile
- Can only attack air

Obvious solution is of course to use both, and stop arguing which one is the best. Both have advantages/disadvantages for different scenarios.

And you're BOTH forgetting the über detector above all: MINES!! (Dragon can vouch for me on this, right??)

[WickedImposter]

i know. but like before, what if they send in like 1 zlot at a time to soak mines? gosh blupp, i thought youd know that playing p.

[blupp74]

i know. but like before, what if they send in like 1 zlot at a time to soak mines? gosh blupp, i thought youd know that playing p.

Then that zealot dies, and T plants new mines. So?

[WickedImposter]

ya, but, your wasting mines that you could be using in a push. unless the mines are just adelay for the turret.

[blupp74]

ya, but, your wasting mines that you could be using in a push. unless the mines are just adelay for the turret.

Early game every mine is precious and needs to be placed strategically correct, but mid/late game when you have 30 vultures (and 15 more in production) you have 90 mines to place. I'm sure you won't be crying too much about the mines that killed the zealot.

[WickedImposter]

ya but remember, were talkign about a dt rush. early game youll need to spare every mine, like you said, and you wont have like 15 facs pumping.

[blupp74]

ya but remember, were talkign about a dt rush. early game youll need to spare every mine, like you said, and you wont have like 15 facs pumping.

If we're talking early game and DT rush then P will most likely not want to waste the few units he has by sending them to soak up mines, unless he knows exactly where they are and how many. Especially since there may be no mines at all, just a vulture to kill off the zealot.
(And if he wants to rush really fast, he may just be saving all his cash, and doesn't even have a zealot...what do I know...)

But I've kinda forgotten what we're arguing about here.

[DragonPraetor]

K I see both your sides but uhm...

Ready?

Abyss is right, pending upon how you planted your mines... 1 zlot can soak them all up, a good P player won't have the DTs far behind. So as you replant said mines, the DTs come up. You panic after getting 2 off and then cower in fear... DUN DUN DUN!

If the mines get in the ground he moves 1 dt up and the other one back so only 1 takes damage. You do what? Nothing... Unless you want to mine your whole base.

The simple solution is to just have turrets everywhere... They only cost 75 and are the immediate opposite of a vulture... If it's luna, get like 2 science vessels and some gols to do the job.

Honestly, comsat is nice for games where you can't get Science Vessels because it takes awhile to tech to them successfully in TvP... So... Whatever, your own play style... Play it, win it... Play it again... Become pro.

GL:D

[blupp74]

K I see both your sides but uhm...

Ready?

Abyss is right, pending upon how you planted your mines... 1 zlot can soak them all up, a good P player won't have the DTs far behind. So as you replant said mines, the DTs come up. You panic after getting 2 off and then cower in fear... DUN DUN DUN!

If the mines get in the ground he moves 1 dt up and the other one back so only 1 takes damage. You do what? Nothing... Unless you want to mine your whole base.

The simple solution is to just have turrets everywhere... They only cost 75 and are the immediate opposite of a vulture... If it's luna, get like 2 science vessels and some gols to do the job.

Honestly, comsat is nice for games where you can't get Science Vessels because it takes awhile to tech to them successfully in TvP... So... Whatever, your own play style... Play it, win it... Play it again... Become pro.

GL:D

I was joking when I said mines are the über detector of all, referring to my game with dutch that you obsed. He had some comments about my ferocious mine-laying. And who won that game? ME!

Anyways, a combination of all available detection methods is of course best. But if we're talking early game and I can only have one, I would choose turrets, cause I'd rather have permanent and reasonably resiliant (but immobile) detection than weak and unreliable (mines) or fast and unrestrained but short-lived detection (comsat).

[WickedImposter]

ya. earlier, id get turrets. but later on, youll have enough comsat to save your ass.