Noob: Need help with Final Terran Mission

[chrome5879]

Hi everyone I am new here.
I dusted off my Starcraft CD after many years and decided to get my chops back by playing through the Vanilla missions again.

I'm on the final Terran mission and was wondering if anyone on here could help.

I breezed through all the other missions w/o a prob, but this mission is kicking my ass.

I'm getting nuked too often, and then the first wave of siege tanks and goliaths is wiping me out.

What I'm doing is 10 SCV's on Minerals, 3 on gas. Then I basically worked up the tech tree with all buildings. Just outside both ramps on the upper level I created a supply depot on each corner with a bunker behind it, with one siege tank and 2 missile turrets. then 3 extra turrets along the wall just in front of my base. At this point, it's taking me a long time to get my armor and weapons upgrades for the tanks so they get wiped out in the first wave of attacks. I have way too many minerals stocked up, and not enough vespene gas, which is why it takes too long for me to upgrade my vehicles in the armory.

Thanks in advance,
chrome

[ITSTORRASQUE4U]

This is "the hammer falls" or something like that, right? In any case, one siege tank per ramp is not enough. I would leave upgrading for later, get 5 scvs on gas and EXPAND. Make that 3 tanks per ramp. Against nukes, a science vessel running around and a dropship with marines can work.

The most important thing is expanding. My cd broke, I miss those missions. Hope I was of any help.

[Alexisonfire]

press enter then type "there is no cow level"

[MatGeo]

Lol jays has a practical solution to any problem...too bad cheating sucks. :P

[U-238]

press enter then type "there is no cow level"

meh, all these forum noobs always taking the easy way out. :P

Okay here we go (again)

You're not making nearly enough scvs. Pump scvs non stop for the first 15-20 minutes. Meanwhile send raynor up your ramp to the east exit and have him plant one of his mines at the very corner. (this will kill the first advancing ghost that will drop a nuke. Once that mine is gone have him plant another one in the same spot) Build up about 12-18 tanks, around 6 vultures, and some 8-12 goliaths.(from around 4-6 factories) Head into the red base and pwn everything there. Then build a cc in the red base and transfer some of your scvs to the new base and start mining. Then you're going to need at least 6 starports. Here you can either do a massive drop of tanks, vults, and rines. (rines can't be locked down). Or you can build a fleet of battlecruisers and a few science vessles. Either way advance on the cannon quickly otherwise you're going to get worn down by nukes and tanks.

That's a quick summery.

[Ahzz]

10 on minerals is way too little. make it atleast 20. When you get the possibility to take an expansion, do so. Don't take too much time. you could take white (nuke guy) out first, not bothering in making marines or other stuff, but making 2-3 factories right away, doing about 12 tanks and a few gols just in case air comes. also make a comsat. use siege mode and scan to go your way through before he gets any nukes or anything. you could take whites base, and now just build some battle cruisers and gogoo...

its been a while since I played this :P

[chrome5879]

Thanks everyone for the tips!!!

Yeah thanks on the tip to send Raynor out. What killed me was the constant nuke attacks.

By the time I was ready to expand to the red base, I only had 2 BC's, and then my gas was depleted, but I had a surplus of minerals, so not enough to create more BC's. Then my ST's and Goliath's got wiped out by the red base's, and their stupid science vessel, EMP'ed my BC's.

How come whenever they send a group of Goliaths and ST's, they completely overrun my bunkers and ST's. In the previous missions those were enough to hold down my base while I expanded.

I'm wasting too much minerals trying to hold down my fort and repair everything that I'm left with little to nothing to go out and expand....
*sigh*.

Well, sorry to interrupt to regular days with more interesting conversations....

@Alexisonfire: LOL, if I wanted to do that, then I wouldn't be posting on this forum. I also wouldn't be dusting off my CD, and running through the missions again. I like the challenge.

[Ahzz]

the reason they wipe out your defense is most likely that either they got more tanks than you, and other reason is that they attack right after they see something, so first goes bunks and then tanks, not both the same time. I belive you didn't use your money and units very effectively.. atleast you got red base right? well if you did, now be more careful how you're spending your money. you gotta make dropships, and load them full of units, it doesn't matter much if some are marines and stuff. unload them all (you might wanna do a few wraiths to take missile turret dmg and ghost lockdown.) and just take it. you ONLY gotta kill ion cannon, not everything. the problem which most players make, is that they send only very few at a time. gather up a bigger army and just roll over, wait a bit and just take it sure

[chrome5879]

Thanks again for all the responses.
I'm still at work, so I haven't tried anything out yet.

But I was just wondering. What are some general tips, rules of thumb you suggest.

I agree, that I need to just concentrate on minerals first, and pump out SCV's. Do you suggest that for the additional supply depots, to build them on the upper level? If so, that will trigger the first response from the computer, right?

Also, if that is the case, how do you suggest to protect those?
I'm thinking, maybe 4-5 turrets along the wall in front of the ramps.
Then for the bunkers, should I just place them along the east and west passages, with a couple of turrets. I'm thinking then, that I'll place at least 3 siege tanks behind the bunkers. So this way I leave the area right above the ramps for placing all my extra supply depots. during this time I'll send raynor out to put the spider mine where the first ghost does his nuclear launch.

Meanwhile I will do the appropriate marine upgrades and vehicle upgrades.

I'll update you, once I get to play tonight.

I can't wait to get through this mission.
As another poster mentioned, I really love/prefer playing as the Zerg.

I can't wait to get to those missions. I remember last time I played, I never completed the Zerg missions.

You can expect me to post here more, once I start those.
Hopefully once my chops are up, I can see you guys in battle.net.

Thanks again guys, and thanks for the warm welcomes and advice.

chrome - out....

[WickedImposter]

ya again, 10 scvs is not enough. and 5 scvs on gas is too many. the most youll need on a well made map is 3.

[U-238]

Also, if that is the case, how do you suggest to protect those?
I'm thinking, maybe 4-5 turrets along the wall in front of the ramps.
Then for the bunkers, should I just place them along the east and west passages, with a couple of turrets. I'm thinking then, that I'll place at least 3 siege tanks behind the bunkers. So this way I leave the area right above the ramps for placing all my extra supply depots. during this time I'll send raynor out to put the spider mine where the first ghost does his nuclear launch.


Put the depots back in the little area in the far west end of your base. By the time you're ready to move out that area should start to just get crowded. After you take red that area should be full but not to worry because reds base now affords you plently of room.

Well, sorry to interrupt to regular days with more interesting conversations....


Naw not a problem. It's just we've seen threads like this (asking for help on T10) like 3-4 times in under 6 months. I'm thinking I (or one of us) should write a guide to this and just link people who ask to the guide. :P

[TheBlackAbyss]

When I did this mission, I didn't even bother to touch any of the bases, red or white.

Get more SCV's on your minerals. Thats crucial. As for defences, I know this isn't practical, but it helped me. Keep about 3 seige tanks per one of the ramps, on the top. Don't go to far or red will smoke you from that ledge. Next, use that mineral surplus! Make marines. Keep them behind the tanks, or even with them. If they go in front, seige tanks will roast them, out of your tanks range. Make it so the enemy tank has to come in your range before it seiges. Once it does, you're own tanks will have taken it out. Meanwhile, micro the marines to fight off gols. 6 gols will fall to the rines without an issue. I know thats not practical, but oh well.

I have to go ~~ Edit this when I have a chance.

[chrome5879]

Sorry guys.
I just aint' gettin' no love.

I'm busy building up my defense. By that time, when I'm ready to inch towards the red base, my defenses and guys that are ready to move into red get wiped out, by ghosts, battleships, and science vessels (they shockwave my BC's). By that time I've spent so much on upgrades and defenses, that while I'm trying to build a force to attack red:

1) they get wiped by an attack force near the base
2) my mineral gathering slows down so I can't build a force fast enough to advance.

[Ahzz]

I just dont get it why you're in a hurry building defense. in blizzard campaigns they take quite a while to attack the first time, and the first attack is indeed very weak. one bunker with 4 marines and MAYBE 1 siege tank will easily fend off atleast the first attack. maybe even second, if repair them and add another tank + missile turret. Just keep making those scvs. atleast 20 at minerals in ONE base. just make 12 tanks and a few goliaths as fast as possible, and move out. dont worry about defense. offense is also defense, and if you attack fast enough their attacks will be fairly small and even while attacking youre still safe. You seriously dont need that much defense in campaigns. attacking makes the best defense. as long as you keep making some units while you attack, you'll do just fine. even if another opponent attacks, the units you've made meanwhile will kill them very easily.
You could also go and search google videos. use something like : Starcraft +solution
There should be a perfect solution video how to finish it.

[chrome5879]

Thanks Ahzz.

Maybe that's my prob.
I'm spending too much $$ and resources on defense, that even when I am ready to take on the Red Base, I don't have the resources to build up an attack force to expand, or even defend the expansion.

I'm seriously considering uploading a replay of my piss-poor gaming, so you can see what I'm doing wrong.

I'll take your advice though and check out google video.

I've been so pissed that I haven't even gone back to the game in like 4 days, I just keep getting beat down. :cry:

[splatt0r]

edit: sorry just found the awnser to my question.

[chrome5879]

Sorry to keep dragging this out....
Just let me know and I'll shut up :)

So I googled the solution. I was apprehensive because for me that's almost like the first response to this thread where you just enter the cheat code.

What the guy in the google solution did, is actually none of the above solutions.

The only thing he did do similar was put all SCV's on minerals and concentrate on that.

He built no base defenses whatsoever. As soon as he had enough minerals, he built an extra couple of SCV's. One for building Supply Depot's when necessary, the other for constructing other buildings.
He built a barracks and factory and placed them unprotected at the top level, and just moved the Vulture and 2 siege tanks (unsieged) next to them. Next he built 3 starports.

Then he built 12 wraiths, with no armor or weapons upgrades, only cloak ability.

Once the wraiths were built he started moving them towards the Ion Cannon.

And beat the mission in 7 minutes.

My problem with this is.
First of all, the Ion cannon's perimeter is guarded by turrets, and at least one Science vessel and several ghosts and goliaths.

He hit one of the turrets, in a hit and run, w/o destroying it.
But what amazed me is that when he moved over to the Ion cannon, all the surrounding ghosts and goliaths sat idly by and did not attack his wraiths.

Even when I'm cloaked, the goliaths can still attack my wraiths. I assume that the computer does a comsat scan, whenever my wraiths attack their units.

I find the solution suspect.

I followed the mission exactly, up until my 12 wraiths get to the Ion cannon. Even cloaked, all their goliaths simultaneously attack them, in addition the ghosts will lock down several of the wraiths, rendering my attack uneffective.
Then I tried the hit and run technique on the turrets and even took 2 of the turrets out, and then cloaked, by their goliaths still take me out.

I just don't see anyway that a sole contingent of wraiths can take out the Ion cannon undetected, and unattacked while they destroy it.

This solution is obviously the quickest. Since it involves no base defenses and not engaging any of the enemy bases, any variation or longer time spent, and you can see how the whole thing can fall to hell.

1) you have no base defenses or vehicle upgrades, so whatever units are left behind will get destroyed, if the enemy sends a contingent of siege tanks and goliaths.

2) you have no base defenses, so you are vulnerable to nuke attacks, if your wraith attack fails.

3) It's a kamakaze solution, all or nothing.

So I'm back at square one, ready to shove the SC CD back into the drawer from whence it came, and/or just going on ahead to the Zerg or Protoss missions anyway w/o completing the last Terran mission.

But the gamer/completist in me will never rest, I would hate to move on to the next episode w/o having properly passed each level. This is exactly why I hated playing Terran. It's a walk in the park up until the last mission.

Anyway, Ahzz, I'll scrap the google solution, and try again when I'm done being mad. I'll try just forging on ahead w/o base defenses. NOT with wraiths, but at least trying to take over red base or something.

[Ahzz]

what was I all the time telling you? forget all the shit defense in your base, upgrades are not in a hurry. the thing is, if you attack THEIR units they scan, but if its only ion cannon?

and the terran last mission hardly has and plot anyway. no ending text or anything, so yea, you could go z/p right away

[chrome5879]

@Ahzz--- Ok, sorry dad :D

I just searched the boards, and checked out the previous threads on this subject.

I'm going to hopefully attempt a few more times by the end of the week, if not the weekend.

There were some good suggestions on the other threads about this mission.

I'll try sending the wraiths again, cloaked, without hitting any of their targets, and meanwhile try and take the middle expansion, and build some BC's. Hopefully before the white base sends a legion of ghosts.

Hopefully I'll succeed by the end of the weekend.

Cheers,
chrome

[IrishDutchman]

For if you don't know how to download replays:

Click on the link, then save it to the file replays, under maps, in starcraft.
Then start up 1 player SC and click view replay. Choose the one you want to watch.

I've got a replay of Kismet doing this campaign. All you need to know is in here.

Have fun blowing up metal stuff!

5566

[ShadeZ]

The google solution is a replay of the fastest time recorded, not an easy strategy to pull off.

[ares232]

This mission I just nuked the cannon when I got the chance, as many times as it took. But before that I dropshipped several ghosts and goliaths next to the platform. Leave some siege tanks by the platform then comsat a few times (nuke platform area too) it helps. Just remember to focus all your units on the cannon.

[chrome5879]

Thanks a billion, Nasty Ape.
That replay was a godsend.

Still haven't beaten it though.
I keep getting nuked.....

[IrishDutchman]

Just keep trying, and save replays of you playing the campaign. Watch them, and then compare them to the replay by Kismet. Try to figure out what he did differently so you can improve.]

[splatt0r]

Just finnished the mission. Time: 19:55 min

Why wasn't I able to save replay I ask?

Anyway what I've done is:

Scouted and killed all the rines wondering around with raynor.

Made 2 facs about 14-16 tanks and waited for their push. Lifted my rax and sieged all the tanks in the left base of the red. Expanded and got gas only. Made 6 starports, 8 bcs, 2 drops with tanks. Destroyed the ion cannon. GG

Thanks a billion, Nasty Ape.
That replay was a godsend.

Still haven't beaten it though.
I keep getting nuked.....

You cant stay camped in your base :/ you must attack quick, and their base should be destroyed before they nuke you.

[Ahzz]

Duuhh?? why are you, nastyape, talking shit when you know nothing? :D:D anyway, you cant save replays when playing campaign for several reasons. and thread author: you just play too slow. way too slow. my guess is you dont use enough scvs, you dont attack effectively, build too much defense and when you attack you only take part of your units with you. forget ALL of those cons, and just DO it. do it fast, do it good enuf, take exps when you can and dont let them gather units. the thing is, if you attack, and lose, you gotta just attack quite fast again. the comps are stupid and wont be able to retaliate for the next attacks.

[splatt0r]

anyway, you cant save replays when playing campaign for several reasons.

And what are the reasons? I would like to save some :/

[Ahzz]

....??? duhh? because blizzard made it like that, so you cant just start and end your game and watch the whole map, every unit and base and look for possible weak spots. to not discover stuff, to prevent cheating in other words. besides, why'd you wanna look replays of a campaign? they're all so dam easy no-one is interested about it. Kismet made it with a much more complicated style, which imo isn't worth it. and I'm not gonna explain it anymore

[IrishDutchman]

Duuhh?? why are you, nastyape, talking shit when you know nothing? :D:D anyway, you cant save replays when playing campaign for several reasons. and thread author: you just play too slow. way too slow. my guess is you dont use enough scvs, you dont attack effectively, build too much defense and when you attack you only take part of your units with you. forget ALL of those cons, and just DO it. do it fast, do it good enuf, take exps when you can and dont let them gather units. the thing is, if you attack, and lose, you gotta just attack quite fast again. the comps are stupid and wont be able to retaliate for the next attacks.


Uhm, then how exactly did kismet save his replay?

[ares232]

I have copies of the camps.. You need a copy of the camps I think.

[ares232]

Make sure you have your comast set as #1. So you can scan before you get nuked. Build a few detectors or science vessels too. Make sure you protect Raynor at all times, work on your offense and find a way to save it as a replay or get a few screenshots using "print screen"

[Ahzz]

pfft. stating more than the obvious^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[U-238]

Yep, you'd need to extract the map from the CD and play it like a UMS.

[chrome5879]

@Ahzz you are absolutely correct, I know I am too slow, that's why I get smacked down.

@Splatt0r: That's what I've been trying to do. I scout around with Raynor to kill all the surrounding rines, while I'm busy building 2 factories.
The last time I played, I almost took the red base. However, white sent 2 BC's and a contingent of siege tanks and goliaths to hit my base.

I've said "screw it" to my defenses. I was just building up an attack force to destroy the red base and almost succeeded but they hit my base at the same time.

I don't get enough time to play. I just play during short bursts of 1-2 hours, 1 maybe 2 days a week.

[Ahzz]

build a few missile turrets to strategic positions when it gets to that and set a few tanks to a cliff to shoot upcoming white army. as you probably have your factories rally points near your base, while you build and attack, you'll still have quite a army there if white attacks. what you should do is that you start some units, attack, and after you've got your tanks sieged and they're shooting (the AI is good enough for this so that you can complete the map) go and build some tanks and maybe a few goliaths over from the factories. once you got 2 gasses you should have atleast 4-6 factories.

I think the main problem is, that you build army and attack, but dont build while attacking. well this should be fixed. build while you attack, its more important to build, than to control the units as you dont have any real experience with controlling the units, they wont really benefit from it. it doesn't matter if your tank attack get slowed down by a minute or two, if you got alot of units in your base ready. once you do, send more units to help the previous ones if they survived. you could also type there is no cow level, play zerg and protoss campaigns and then return there and pwn it

[ares232]

This a replay of "The Hammer Falls", if you work hard at it, you should win in about an hour. I did some stupid things against the comp but still won. Make sure you're ready when White attacks and have a few wraiths or extra tanks lying around. Don't go and research a lot of stuff unless you know you're going to use it. Like marine armor and weapons. Don't use nukes unless you have extra resources, otherwise its a lost cause. Make sure you comsat the cannon after you raid it a few times, sometimes the comp will only leave a few golitahs or marines to defend it. Overall, worry about offense more than defense and get rid of Red early.

[ares232]

Oh and btw, in this rep I use a building to scout early. Its something I've had pulled on me in melees.

[splatt0r]

This a replay of "The Hammer Falls", if you work hard at it, you should win in about an hour. I did some stupid things against the comp but still won. Make sure you're ready when White attacks and have a few wraiths or extra tanks lying around. Don't go and research a lot of stuff unless you know you're going to use it. Like marine armor and weapons. Don't use nukes unless you have extra resources, otherwise its a lost cause. Make sure you comsat the cannon after you raid it a few times, sometimes the comp will only leave a few golitahs or marines to defend it. Overall, worry about offense more than defense and get rid of Red early.

1 hour???? lol omg

[ares232]

What to long? Yeah it was a long time since I'd last played that mission. So I was pretty rusty. And the fact that you can't train medics for restoration makes it worse.

[ShadeZ]

I can't look at a replay of that mission that drags on an hour, I'd yawn myself to sleep :/

[chrome5879]

@ares232: Thanks a million, I'll let you know once I get a chance to watch the replay.

An update on my current situation for those of you kind enough to regularly post on here...

I ended up starting off the way the KisMet replay is again.
So basically start off with a barracks and 2 factories. Sending Raynor out to scout and picking off the red rines to the west and NW.

Then with my first contingent of tanks, I start moving toward the red base, but setting a seige tank along the way at the choke points and ramps and an scv to build turrets next to the seige tanks (to ward off wayward battleships and science vessels).

All the while I'm building up a troop of tanks to send into the red base.
Then I build a 2nd barracks closer to red base.
I sent a troop of tanks and one of the original troops of rines to red and took out most of hte base and setup a 2nd command center.

i havne't had time to get back to the game yet.
When I do I'll let you guys know.

One thing I need to do now is fortify both passages leading from East to West into the former Red Base.

At this point I have 1 science vessel in the space just outside the platform leading to the Ion Cannon and 3 battlecruisers.

I have built a second science center w/ Covert Ops, to attach a nuclear silo to my 2nd command center.

[jac195]

Guys, to save replays in the SC and BW missions, you need to extract them from the cd using WinMPQ, and then play em in ums. Anyhoo, I'll post a strategy and rep in a moment.

[jac195]

Alrighty then, here it is!

Comments:
-I quickly built up a strong SCV force
-For defence i laid down some bunkers and 3 seige tanks
-I teched to Science Vessel as quickly as possible. As a result, I never got nuked cause I killed all the ghosts.
-I attacked the Red base twice. On my second attempt, I broke through their defences and neutralized Red. I set up a base there.
-I got a force of 6 BCs and a Science Vessel to hit the Ion Cannon. I got locked down, a lot, but I broke through in the end and smashed the Ion Cannon

[Infested_Zeratul]

omg, how did you guys beat this one without cheats? I beat it without cheats long long ago because i didn't know SC had cheats, but last year until now, i tried again and again, my entire expo gets owned when I move to the center area, if i stay in the smaller area to build up my forces, i get BC rushed and there's even one time, the bunkers and seige tanks above got nuked, and trust me, I tried my hardest to get a science vessel, but the enemies are soo fast. The battle cruisers attack me like the Battlecruisers in birds of war.

[chrome5879]

OK Guys!!! I finally beat it!
To everyone who posted replays, sorry I didn't get a chance to check them out or follow them.

The secret to this level is speed and attack.

I kept getting destroyed though and had to keep trying different strategies each time.

At my original base I kept 2 or three turrets. 3 siege tanks per ramp. A science vessel in the space area, and 1 battlecruiser. They toook care of the ghosts who tried doing the nuke attacks.

I started off with raynor taking care of the 'rines and doing an initial scouting of the red base.

Then I sent several siege tanks and a constant barrage of rines to take out red.
I built an extra barracks between my original base and red.

Once I owned Red, I built a second comsat.
Then I put turrets everywhere, especially the 2 pathways to red. Next I had a whole lot of seige tanks to back up the turrets.

I kept doing comsat scans to take out ghosts.

at the same time I took the expansion, for extra minerals
Because if you are going to attack/build/defend at the same time you need more minerals.

I used 12 marines and a couple of turrets to defend the expansion.

Then I built up 8 battlecruisers.
While they were building up, I sent several marines/goliaths/siege tanks to the platform where the ion cannon is. They took care of all the surrounding turrets and ghosts.

At that point the 8 battlecruisers destroyed the ion cannon.

Sorry i didn't save a replay.

Thanks for all who helped.

Cheers,
chrome

[own3d0406]

OK Guys!!! I finally beat it!
To everyone who posted replays, sorry I didn't get a chance to check them out or follow them.

The secret to this level is speed and attack.

I kept getting destroyed though and had to keep trying different strategies each time.

At my original base I kept 2 or three turrets. 3 siege tanks per ramp. A science vessel in the space area, and 1 battlecruiser. They toook care of the ghosts who tried doing the nuke attacks.

I started off with raynor taking care of the 'rines and doing an initial scouting of the red base.

Then I sent several siege tanks and a constant barrage of rines to take out red.
I built an extra barracks between my original base and red.

Once I owned Red, I built a second comsat.
Then I put turrets everywhere, especially the 2 pathways to red. Next I had a whole lot of seige tanks to back up the turrets.

I kept doing comsat scans to take out ghosts.

at the same time I took the expansion, for extra minerals
Because if you are going to attack/build/defend at the same time you need more minerals.

I used 12 marines and a couple of turrets to defend the expansion.

Then I built up 8 battlecruisers.
While they were building up, I sent several marines/goliaths/siege tanks to the platform where the ion cannon is. They took care of all the surrounding turrets and ghosts.

At that point the 8 battlecruisers destroyed the ion cannon.

Sorry i didn't save a replay.

Thanks for all who helped.

Cheers,
chrome
Turtle, mass, and attack FTW!

[jac195]

no, thats FTL. It does make you win, but its no fun :(