Some help here, please.. ZvZ

[smkd]

Well, here goes my situation:

I'm often playing ZvZ, since most of my friends use Zerg.
I'm having problems with one of them... The point is that the game gets pointless

He starts building sunken and spore colonies... and never stops.

The point is that I don't know what to do to go inside his base
I've tried mutaling... his spores kill all mutas, but if I send the lings to kill the spores, the sunken colonies kill the lings

I'm wondering if ultralisks are a useful option, but he will probably make a few queens and sodomize them

Well, the game gets pointless, he can't come inside my base since I have much more units than him, and I can't go inside his

What should I do? Opinions please :p

Thanks

[Ahzz]

ultralisks and lings. Add in dark swarm, and you might not need ultras. guardians could be a option too.

[ShadeZ]

Make sure to take all the expos in the level if he can't get out. If he's losing, there's no way he'll lose to large amounts of expos pumping whatever. There gets the point where you can make anything you want and be successful in a game.

If nothing works guardians own static D.

Btw, I don't think that dark swarm works on sunks, does it?

[WickedImposter]

i would tech to guards. youll have time because he spent tons of resources on static defense.

[smkd]

Thank you both.. about the dark swarm on suken I don't know if it works... gotta test that


would be 9 pool quick enough to end the game quick?

Yea... it seems guards would be the best way of winning this game

Thanks ;)

[Cpt.Chronic]

I'd just go muta-ling and use your superior numbers to keep him from expoing while you take multiple expansions yourself. Once you have 3 (or more) gasses going you can easily build up enough mutas to overrun his spore colonies...and build lings with whatever money you have left over.

[ShadeZ]

But if mutaling doesn't work, as he said it didn't, the other zerg is allready lost. I'm assuming we're talking about 30 or so spores/sunkens? Besides, with no money, there's nothing one can do to stop you from teching

[smkd]

yea, 30+ static defenses..

thank you all again

[Alexisonfire]

maybe plague instead of ds

[WickedImposter]

maybe plague instead of ds

ya. that probbably it. anybody know the range of plague though? is it greater or lesser than the range of a sunken?

[smkd]

No idea.. but it would take too long to kill all those sunkun using plague... and he would be able to buy more while one or two dies... seems that guardian is really the best option

[MidnightGladius]

Dark Swarm + Cracklings + Guardians out of 4+gas.

[GroG]

Just pump pure muta for containment, and expand to gasses. Continue to pump pure muta, get upgrades for your muta, yes, get 3/3 muta. Continue to expand, and put spores up yourself. You are weakest when you first expand, every expand after that gets easier, especially if he allows the contain. It can be hard to read when to expand-- If you expand at the wrong time, against a good opponent, he will overrun you either with muta, or with ling, and you'll lose drone. But this guy sounds sucky to me, so you should be able to expo.

Once you max out with 3/3 muta, start picking off spores. send 2 control groups in, one spore apiece, then fly out. Rinse and repeat. Wear him down, and win the game.

The key is to use your muta as "contain" and don't let him expand. Get ovie speed asap, and park ovies all over the place. Every so often, suicide an ovie to see what he's doing. Counter what he's doing. But at this point, it shouldn't even matter since you contained him and expoed the hell out of the map.

Just play a macro based game and you'll win. Remember, don't lose your initial force. Spend available resources to have the same number of attacking forces as him (ie: match his muta, plus try to have more so you don't lose a battle, but don't worry if he outspores you, continue to expo. That's why you suicide ovies every so often, not only to see his tech but to see his units and unit count).

Oh, does he early expo + sunken, or just sunken his main, or what? Because you want to match and expo about the same time he does (or pressure him with speedlings). A good counter to early expo is scourgeling. If he's low muta count, use scourge to kill his muta. If no muta, use scourge to kill his overlords, and run him over with ling (as opposed to early expo, do 2 hat muta ling vs. his early expo). The longer a game draws on, and the more muta your opponent gets, the worse scourge become. But early midgame against those first 6 or so muta, they are GREAT, especially if you can clone.

With pure muta, you can't lose. Honestly. ZvZ is a gas war. Only thing to watch out for is lings, or mutas.

glgl

[WickedImposter]

No idea.. but it would take too long to kill all those sunkun using plague... and he would be able to buy more while one or two dies... seems that guardian is really the best option

umm, actually, 1 plague would bring a sunken down to less than 30 health. plague does 300 dmg, sunks have 300 health. do the math.

[Ahzz]

shut up please.

[Siege_Commander]

You know how long that would take? If only one sunken colony is in the affected area of plauge, then... Takes too damn long.

[WhiteShade]

If I recall correctly the range for plague is closer than a sunken colony... that is you would lose your Defiler...

I wouldn't use Defilers anyway... like everyone has said use Mutas and Lings... the best are Guards though... no Devos at any cost against Mutas!

Also use Scourge against Guards and Ovies since they cannot attack them back... take out the SpColonies first with Mutas or Guards... then worry about the SuColonies... hope this helps some...

Just listen to the guy before me (I'm not good with names) and use mine for assault...

Weaken him (that is if you want) with some suicide forces... wait that would draw him out...

Ultimate Ground= Ultras and Guards and Lings
Ultimate Air= Mutas and Scourge(distractions)

Ultimate Ground tactic has no air defense but kick but on the ground... team them up with scourge to get rid of the queens...

[Siege_Commander]

what units does he have? If he turtles, just keep expoing and contain him. Then listen to the other guys here:P

[MidnightGladius]

Yeah, there's not much to say against pure turtlers.