This or GuildWars?

[Fenix-MSG]

I dont play MMORPG's a whole lot, ive played EQ for a while at a friends house and runescape but thats about it. This might be a long shot but does any one happen to be a beta tester for this and guild wars? Though i think guildwars may still be in alpha testing im not sure. I know the response im probably going to get since i am on a World of Warcraft board, but for anyone that knows alot about both of the games, which one looks better.

[Battlecruiser]

I know the response im probably going to get since i am on a World of Warcraft board, but for anyone that knows alot about both of the games, which one looks better.
That would be Radlin.

[Exedore]

I know Adovid is an alpha tester for Guild Wars. You can ask him about that, or wait until E3 and play Guild Wars for 3 day as a kind of public beta/promotion of the game (more info (http://www.guildwars.com/e3-2004/default.html)).

[Graeme]

It's actually somewhat humourous that you're comparing the two games, because WoW is the child of Blizzard, and GuildWars is the child of AreaSoft (NCsoft), which include several (I think the magic number is 3) key ex-Blizz players.

Both games actually look to be quite promising, and I'll do my best to give you a solid bit of info, without going too overboard on the WoW preaching ^_~. However, I have not played Guildwars, nor have I played World of Warcraft. I just happen to know a wee bit about WoW, and an even smaller bit about GuildWars :p.

First and foremost, you should note that GuildWars is a non-monthly fee MMO game. If money is at all an issue for you, you may be happier off without paying the 10-15 USD a month and playing GuildWars. Now, for the real meat and potatoes. I'll start us off with a wee bit of info about Guild Wars, and then contrast those issues with info on WoW a bit later.

Guild Wars uses streaming technology to allow data to be transferred directly to your computer while you are playing the game. Patches will be non-existent, and the game will shape itself as you're playing. It also has a single world, in which all players will be using, instead of several different worlds (ie. most MMOs have several servers that people connect to, and have separate characters on). This allows people to stay in contact with eachother, without having to worry about which server they play on.

As far as I can tell, Guild Wars is more of a 'elitist' game. Not-so-much in the fact that people that want to play it casually won't have fun, but the people that are dedicated to learning the game will definately excel. Think along the lines of a FPS like Counterstrike. New people are still able to have fun in the game, but it is very likely they'll get slaughtered a few hundred times before they actually contend with the experts (note: hyperbole ^_~). And with the massive amount of support they claim to have for guilds, I'm sure we'll see many 'leet' gamers joining up and attempting to wreak havoc.

I see the main difference between Guild Wars and World of Warcraft as Guild Wars' way of dealing with the problems that often arouse in MMO games. Instead of trying to fix these problems, Guild Wars has merely ousted the entire situations. Keep in mind that this isn't always a bad thing.

Travelling from area to area will be almost instantaneous, as you'll be able to teleport from outpost to outpost and participate in different quests. The death penalty is near non-existent, as it only affects you during your current mission/quest (a mere drop in energy and health). Basically, they're trying to eliminate any grief that a player could ever experience in a MMO, and allow a smooth, fast-paced ride the entire way through.

However, I personally don't think this is the way to go about doing it. My fear is that GuildWars will face an economic inflation, similar to that of Diablo 2. Without a solid challenge to keep people in-line at all times, the game will end up breeding numerous high-level gamers that've hit a brick wall. What DO you do when you have a bunch of maxed out characters and own a fair amount of property? Games like that often-times get boring.

To step over to the 'WoW' side of things . . .

It is my personal opinion that WoW will end up being a bit more 'professional' about the entire scene. The staff at Blizzard are known to be perfectionists, and we can anticipate a near-perfected game. WoW will be using MMO traditional-style patching to update the game, however, I am certain these patches will be numerous, as well as happen quite often. Blizzard has already noted that they will have many GMs working on the servers 24/7. We will definately not see a decrease in efficiency, in comparison to the 'streaming feature' GW offers.

Blizzard will be using several different servers in order to decrease the amount of lag, and mainly because WoW doesn't follow the same 'mission style' format that Guild Wars does. WoW relies heavily on its servers, and to force them to generate a single world for tens of thousands of gamers would definately throw the servers in a tumult.

Blizzard, as stated earlier, is doing pretty much the opposite of GW concerning griefing issues apparent in most other MMOs. Blizz is attempting to isolate the issue, and solve it, as opposed to just making the issue entirely obsolete by avoiding it. Blizzard is against having to walk for hours from town to town, but they did not simply add teleports. Instead, you can travel using a variety of different methods, including gryphon rides, mounts, boat, etc.

Blizz also created unique ways to solve the death problem (re: the ghost, and returning to your corpse), as well as stopping griefers player killing other players (re: several forms of PvP, including duels). Blizzard also recently introduced a new (I'd even say strange) way of combatting MMO addiction, MMO binges, economy overflow and elitist players (re: The Rest issue).

I won't go too far in depth about the logistics about WoW, because I'd end up rambling for a good portion of the night, and I have to get studying. If you have anything specific you'd like to ask about it, feel free to ask on these forums and I'll get to your question ASAP.

Once more, I must reiterate that I have never tried Guild Wars, nor have I tried World of Warcraft. I can't really state that you should go with a single MMO either way. I know I'll be getting WoW for sure, and I'll likely pick up GW for fun, since it doesn't have a monthly fee. However, you should note that although both games are placed in the 'MMORPG' category, I can assure you the two games will be vastly different.

[echolon]

Radlin,, don't write so much,gets kinda boring to read it all.. but I can manage to take the time when I have a test tomorrow, ( VERY boring test)

[Graeme]

Radlin,, don't write so much,gets kinda boring to read it all.. but I can manage to take the time when I have a test tomorrow, ( VERY boring test)

Hahaha, it's really not that much. Shouldn't take much more than a minute or two for a fast reader, and if you're just browsing through, it's like a 30 second read :p.

I was going to go into further detail on WoW too, so you're lucky ^_~.

[Battlecruiser]

I find Radlins post to be a very good read. The more information the better.

[echolon]

its good information, but I have like 5 sec to read things when I read it on school, . kinda boring with economics.. but I am still alive, and since I can read stuff here from time to time, things should go well.

[Adovid]

However, I personally don't think this is the way to go about doing it. My fear is that GuildWars will face an economic inflation, similar to that of Diablo 2. Without a solid challenge to keep people in-line at all times, the game will end up breeding numerous high-level gamers that've hit a brick wall. What DO you do when you have a bunch of maxed out characters and own a fair amount of property? Games like that often-times get boring.High level players will not be so much of a problem. Guildwars is going to have a pretty low level cap compaired to some games and even then, leveling does not affect attributes pertaining to every aspect of a players stats such as in diablo. In diablo everyone had health stats, dex stats, vital stats etc. Guildwars only gives a few specific stats related to a class that you are using. Such as marksmanship stats for an archer while a warrior gets defense stats.

Where guildwars lightens up in leveling they make up with the competative aspect of the game. Hence the reason Arena.net calls it a CORPG. Players who reach a certain level will stop worrying about leveling their characters and start worrying about gaining ladder rank or notoriety in the community through the tournaments I imagine(its still all being worked out).

Leveling will be something that is done in order to improve your effectiveness in the competative system but not to a point that eleminates the need for skill. Low level players will also be able to play effectively due to the fact that high level players will only have "so much" advantage. The game doesnt have a steep learning curve, it is as simple as reading what the spells do and then using them in the best way possible.

Also Team work will be an important factor like you said. The game is being aimed to encourage players to create social groups hence the reason its called Guildwars :/.

As far as WOW compaired to Guildwars. I simply think they are going to be too different to compare really. Guildwars is going to focus on competative and team based play while providing many elements from mmorpgs while Wow Is going to throw a little bit of team work with a whole lot of content but also a lot of rules that go along with it. I haven't played Wow so I cannot say exactly.

I really wouldnt have posted this in a Wow forum simply because this game isn't a game that can be measured with wow in the same aspects of gameplay. Some players may like WOW more than GW and some people will like GW more than Wow. It would be a matter of taste more than "better" or "worse", but the no monthly fee is a really good plus in my eyes :/.

I just have more respect for Arena.net for trying to do it this way :/. I bet it was probably very risky on their part, especially since they have no credit to their name. I have met some of the devs and they are just cool guys.

[Graeme]

I just have more respect for Arena.net for trying to do it this way :/. I bet it was probably very risky on their part, especially since they have no credit to their name. I have met some of the devs and they are just cool guys.
No credit to their name? What are you talking about?!

Arena.net is a wholly owned subsidiary of NCsoft.

NCSoft an incredibly large and well known game-software company around, especially in the Eastern hemisphere. NCSoft is probably most well known for their hit MMOG Lineage. Lineage is played by over three million subscribers, and has been going strong for a while now. You may also recognize City of Heroes and Lineage II as games that have been released through NCSoft.

Area.net isn't full of 'newbie' programmers and staff either. It was originally founded by key, senior, ex-staff members of Blizzard. These people have obviously had a large amount of experience with online gaming. They know what they're doing ^_~.

[Adovid]

Area.net isn't full of 'newbie' programmers and staff either. It was originally founded by key, senior, ex-staff members of Blizzard. These people have obviously had a large amount of experience with online gaming. They know what they're doing ^_~.I-know-that... I know who Mike O'Brien and Patrick Wyatt are... I knew who they were 4 years ago...

I am testing their game which I downloaded with a 56k connection(very bad 56k connection)... These guys are gods of network codeing. I know they are good.

I just don't think everyone knows that... Especially the masses who they plan to get their profit from. Since they aren't going to be getting profit by any other means :/. And no, they have not yet proven themselves to be capable at making a successful game, that will not happen until GW goes gold. Sure we can say that we see Arena.net as a big name but we are active in the video game fan community which only represents a small portion of the gaming population. There is a great deal of risk of doing anything of this caliber expecially when they are working with an idea that no one has ever done before.

Not to say that I don’t think they will do good. Just that the way they have done it required some risks they took in order to proved a product to their fans and customers. They could have just followed the trend and set up a system that would require a monthly fee. If they had done it that way maybe they wouldn’t have needed to spend the 3 years working on this infrastructure with nothing more than loans and money from their own pockets. Last year they were eager to announce their game but due to the fact that they had spent so much time on the network code and that they didn't have the artists they do now, the result was more negative then positive with respect from the outside. There were still people asking if the graphics from last e3 were still in gw even only a few months ago.

I can asure you that the graphics are excelent now.

[Graeme]

I can asure you that the graphics are excelent now.

No kidding, take a gander at this beauty ^_^:

http://guildwars.com/images/JPG/gwscreens/gwscreen032-lrg.JPG

[Battlecruiser]

I guess there will be some competition going on between guildwars and world of warcraft.

[TranquilNightElf]

No kidding, take a gander at this beauty ^_^:



I can asure you that the graphics are excelent now.

Yeah the graphics are rad alright. I like the soft glow that touches everything.They're quite proud of it.

[Graeme]

I guess there will be some competition going on between guildwars and world of warcraft.

I hope not. The games aren't THAT similar, and since GuildWars is non-monthly fee, I'm thinking a lot of gamers will play it as an alternative to WoW for a bit of a break from time-to-time.

At least, that's my plan ^_^.

[Adovid]

Thats exactly what I was thinking :). Guildwars doesnt really have to compete with other mmorpgs because it has no monthly fee. People will buy the game just so that they can have it even if they are already paying monthly fees to a mmorpg and they know they wont spend much time playing. GW would be an alternative to fall back on. And with GW being a little more friendly to casual players, that wont be a problem at all.

Anyway, you guys will be able to try (http://guildwars.com/e3-2004/default.html) it out during e3 which is in 2 days.

[Achelus]

Sure we can say that we see Arena.net as a big name but we are active in the video game fan community which only represents a small portion of the gaming population.
Blah blah blah, this isn't the music industry, you don't have to be well known.

You need 3 things for a successful game.
1. A good distributor. They've got NCSoft, who's got cash like Asia's got rice.
2. Good developers. These guys are huge, the main guy behind Battle.net for christs sake.
3. Good press. Their past work and NCSoft will ensure that all the big sites give them publicity (and if you look around, they've been getting it).

Just read this list:
http://www.arena.net/about/team.html

Mike was featured as one of the 25 most influential people in the game industry...He (Pat) was most recently the team lead and lead programmer of Battle.net...Jeff (was) team lead and lead programmer of Blizzard's massively multiplayer role-playing game, World of Warcraft. (and) the creator of the StarCraft Campaign Editor.
I know a couple people who turned down jobs at Blizzard to work at Arena.net, so don't shed too many tears for them being "new".

[Adovid]

Maybe your right, I have probably been reading into it too long. I just remember a time when there were only a handful of people who were active in their fan base :/.

Anyway, The e3 demo is available now, go log in.

[Windwalker]

Radlin how do you feel about the rest period?

[Ole-The-Murder]

I hope they have made/make a system that will rise the challenges for your infinitely as your character progresses in level, but just as their resistance rise according to your powers, to constant keep the enemy a real enemy, and not just experience you can gather boringly, but actually have a good and fun fight, with alot of ambidexterious moves and flexible spells with withdraws - Since spellcraft isn't just child's play..and neither is waving around with weapons. There should be more quests, more risks (rogue-play) and less fights, and those fights that is should be creative and not repetive. Who's with me? I think Guild Wars is a friggin' freebie, don't know how they can keep it free, but it's okay with me, aslong as I get it for free too!...aslong as my computer can handle it. But I believe World of WarCraft will have more punch, y'know what I am saying?- I hope WoW has a storyline, like the continued story of WarCraft...hopefully. Perhaps you don't agree with z'hat..'nuff said..

[Graeme]

Radlin how do you feel about the rest period?

For the sake of not repeating the exact same things I've said in the past, I'll point you in this direction:
http://www.warboards.org/showthread.php?t=1787

In short, I was originally shocked by the rest states. In fact, I downright hated the idea and looked at it as a timesink. But then I began to hear the feedback, and most of it was along the lines of, "I've been playing all night, and have yet to go below 'Well Rested'." That, combined with the positive feedback given by the Blizz devs and forum admins, allowed me to drop my worries.

I think it will encourage more of a 'community' environment in the MMO. People will be spending time chatting it up, drinking and playing minigames with eachother in the inn, while waiting to become rested again. I am positive that Blizz will continue to listen to the user feedback and tweak the rest system until it works as they, and all the gamers, want it to. No worries ^_^.

[Ole-The-Murder]

I agree, people shouldn't have to really REST, like in sleeping or napping, to rest. I think resting like in doing carefree activities in a tavern, like chatting, drinking and playing, is rest enough assured, mucho fun, and a good leisure from work :beer:
P.S. Did you trust them in what they claimed, they haven't gone below zhè level of "Well Rested"? Hm. Be more sceptical, I suggest :\

[Evangielis]

Hi there. Just joined this forum so bear with me here.

I personally think the rest period is a brilliant idea, most likely speciffically targetted at bringing in players like myself who have a job/kids/business as limiters and can't afford to spend all night playing games. For people like that, it's not so hard to get on every day and play for an hour or two religiously. Rest period would seem to insure that these people won't be so easily outleveled by the power gamers and 1337ists who populate games like EQ.

I'm very much looking forward to it.

[Frattimonde]

I´m gonna say WOW.
It just to seem be something special about It.