Help with humans

[IceFlare]

Alright I just got WC3, not TFT, to see what the hype was about, I was mainly an SC player and still am. But I decided to try it out, so I borrowed my friends disc which just so happens to not work on bnet. So the only way to get a feel for the races was play through campaign and I found that humans were most suited for me.

So humans it is, I started playing against friends on LAN and I just get destroyed. Any tips on playing human? Strats, build orders. I think one big thing is that you start off with gold and lumber in warcraft, unlike SC where you just had enough for 1 worker to start off.

Right now, my "best" strat is riflemans with priests for heal and sorceresses for slow. AM is my hero of choice and I rarely get seige units..

[wa123]

I hope u enjoy playing Warcraft
Im not a human player, I guess my human playing styler won't take u far.

I go for Am, foot man, riflemans as soon as they can pull out, I will keep produce them out, keep upgrade defence and attack for rifleman, until knight available.

or MK with massive mortor and footman with "defence ability" chopper out when over resources


For Am level 1@ water summon
level 2@ ice fall
level 3@ "that ability to increase manna"
Level 4 @ ice fall
level 5@ manna ability
level6@teleport ability

[xodkrm]

My usual build:
Tier 2 push.
Get about 12 or more footmen and 2priest, 2sorc from 1 rax, 2 arcane.
AM
Level 1- summon
Level 2 - Brilliance Aura
Level 3- Summon
Level 4- Brill Aura
Level 5- Summon
Level 6- Teleport

If the push fails, get an expansion, and tech ASAP.
When hit tier 3, get casters with knights.

WARNING: DOES NOT WORK TOO WELL AGAINST UNDEAD, AIR UNITS, SIEGE, HIGH LEVEL HEROS, TOWERS, AND PEOPLE THAT ARE BETTER THAN YOU. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

[whoman_human]

Well first of all download some replays so you can see the normal startbuild. It's mostly an Altar, Barracks and 2-3 houses and so on. I don't know if this might help but I have my standard heros against each race. Vs. human I take the Am or the Mk, against Ud I take the paladin and another one, against orc I take Bloodmage and later Am, against NE I take Bloodmage/archmage or mountainking(not good if the opponent takes Dh)! Hope I could help.

[Yoda]

Use this site for help with humans

http://www.wcreplays.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36292

[IceFlare]

Thanks guys. I THINK my early build is quite good, 4 on gold, 1 for altar and queue 2 peasants. 6th to barracks and 7th to farm?

And also I usually early creep with 4 footmen and an AM and water elemental is this suggested to do? I would think that getting an extra level or more experience than when people attack me almost right after is good? As long as water elemental absorbs all the attacks. Or should I just tech straight to rifles?

[thefazant]

get footies first, mass rifles really sucks

[whoman_human]

I'd say that's a good startbuild. It's also good that you creep early in the game and it's better to have water elemental as a first skill (better than blizzard). I don't play Am that much but you're doing everything good! Don't straight tech to rifles, build minimum 4-5 footman first so you can creep earlier! Maybe you can post a replay so we can help you more.

[RedRagToAnOrc]

Prozerran and Fazant are the two best Hu players on these boards, so it's probably better getting a good build order or two from them, but I'll help as much as I can - considering you asked in such a nice, sensible way. :)

Hu build order varies on whether you are fast expanding - a typical Human gameplay trait - or not, but the general build order is the one you have there. I tend to take another peasant off gold at the start to build a Barracks, 6th builds a Farm (queue another Farm) and then send the rest to gold and wood. It's all down to personal preference.

Archmage is virtually the only hero Human players use these days, especially in the original. The three Human heroes work well together, so it's good to get a Castle and get Archmage/Mountain King/Paladin.

The standard Archmage build order at a decent level is;

1. Water Elemental
2. Brilliance Aura
3. Water Elemental
4. Brilliance Aura
5. Water Elemental
6. Mass Teleport or Brilliance Aura
7. Mass Teleport or Brilliance Aura
8-10. Blizzard

Although this can be revised depending on early and late game plans. The general idea is you attack creeps with the Elemental first so it takes all the damage, and with the Aura effect you can recharge mana quickly and 'spam' them (use them really often). Same thing works if you go Blizzard in place of Elemental but this is very rarely done, only when harrassing or using mass area of effect spells - which is a Frozen Throne tactic and so is kind of irrelevant.

Rifle/caster is a perfectly fine combination against Undead, (although you'll want to get Knights and possibly Gyrocopters when the Undead reaches Black Citadel stage) Orc, and Night-Elf, but you'll get thrashed in Human mirror, when you'll need Knights/Casters. But in all matchups, you'll geenrally want Footmen first, for early game creeping.

Anyway, hope that helps a bit. Enjoy your time on WC and I hope you switch to Frozen Throne at some point! (We need fresh blood around here...) ;)

[IceFlare]

My standard skill order is
Water
Blizz
Water
Blizz
Water
Tele
Blizz
And then the rest auras

I dont get how getting auras would help early? Well maybe i should change up my order and get aura a little earlier but I dunno if aura is a good second

[xodkrm]

I think Brilliance Aura is waayy too strong at level 2 & 3, and needs a little nerf.
If you have two other heros, you literaly have unlimited mana.

[IceFlare]

Are there any keystrokes I shuold be aware of cuz I recently found out that pressing Alt would show the health bar of all units on screen. Someting thats not in sc. Also when is an ideal time to expand cuz I find that i can last pretty long and keep units alive but then I realize my mines running low

[xodkrm]

Shift + right click
tab browses through the different types of units,
cntrl + # puts that group of units in a group
B is build
S is stop
H is hold ground(something like that)
A is attack
P i believe is patrol

There really isn't a time to expand. The more and faster expansions you have, more income you have.

[wa123]

You need to know this 2 button
your army ===> press [
Enemy ===> press ]
I would probably expand when my current gold mind is under $3000,
generally I should have terminate my enemy or got terminated b4 gold mind finish.

[RedRagToAnOrc]

Brilliance Aura works on all nearby heroes and casters, allowing you to spam Storm Bolt and Water Elemental, so yes, it's worth it. Going Elemental and Blizzard means you can't have a decent round of either, so it's better to go one or the other.

Control-Click selects all units of a certain type (eg. Peons, Raiders) as does double click.

Backspace centres on your various Town Halls.

Space centres on the latest 'event'. (eg. You are under attack.)

[thefazant]

you need to have brilliance even if youre not getting that many casters, being able to use bolt
AND clap is simply way too important
together with both speed auras, brilliance is the best aura in the game

[IceFlare]

So try and get Water and brilliance together? Up to mass teleport? I find that blizzard is amazing when combined with slow, they usually dont live through that, but if they do rifles finish up. Also, are the gobblin transports any viable? I was disappointed that in warcraft there wasnt any 'dropship' but the fact that its a merc and can be hired means it can be useful??

And thanks for the keys, I know the hotkeys, I just need to find out what controls that arent in SC

[xodkrm]

Try this build:
Altar
Barracks
Farm
Farm
Farm
Archmage
Keep pumping footmen
Tech ASAP, without slowing down footmen production
Stay at 29 food or 30 food, start building farms half-way tech
Second tier, get one arcane Sanctum
MK, firelord, beastmaster any of these
tech
Get an Expo
Keep adding footmen if their numbers go low
Build towers if opponent is 2nd tier pushing
Build another Aracne & Barracks
Build Lumber mill and blacksmith at 75% of tech
3rd tier
Paladin
Get priests, knights, and a few sorceresses.
*important* 1knight:1priest is good
If resources allow, get gryphons
Start getting upgrades.
You will pawn once you get 3/3

This build is pretty stable, but it can be countered by air, and a hard second tier push.
Solution> Try to use the summons and casters to kill small amounts of air. If opponent is massing air, get dragon riders from gryphon aviary, and few rifles. Second tier push can be stopped by building a few towers in base.

[IceFlare]

Try this build:
Altar
Barracks
Farm
Farm
Farm
Archmage
Keep pumping footmen
Tech ASAP, without slowing down footmen production
Stay at 29 food or 30 food, start building farms half-way tech
Second tier, get one arcane Sanctum
MK, firelord, beastmaster any of these
tech
Get an Expo
Keep adding footmen if their numbers go low
Build towers if opponent is 2nd tier pushing
Build another Aracne & Barracks
Build Lumber mill and blacksmith at 75% of tech
3rd tier
Paladin
Get priests, knights, and a few sorceresses.
*important* 1knight:1priest is good
If resources allow, get gryphons
Start getting upgrades.
You will pawn once you get 3/3

This build is pretty stable, but it can be countered by air, and a hard second tier push.
Solution> Try to use the summons and casters to kill small amounts of air. If opponent is massing air, get dragon riders from gryphon aviary, and few rifles. Second tier push can be stopped by building a few towers in base.what does that mean? And does this build focus on footmen?

[GenocideAlive]

I think Brilliance Aura is waayy too strong at level 2 & 3, and needs a little nerf.
If you have two other heros, you literaly have unlimited mana.
Please stop bullshitting.

HU's strong point is their casters, and their melee is gimped in return.

MK as a second hero gets an additional 30 mana for every 30s battle--which isn't even enough to cast a Stormbolt. Brilliance doesn't give you invincible heroes or unlimited mana--any moreso than moonwells give you infinite HP and infinite mana.

[xodkrm]

what does that mean? And does this build focus on footmen?
75% of tech means 3/4 way of tech.
The build i posted focusus on the knights, casters, few gryphons, and three heros. Footmen are used through tier 1-2.

And about brilliance aura- Im not bullshitting about anything. That how I see the spell. O.0

[Prozerran]

Ok, I really think a Mod needs to sticky a "Basic Gameplay" thread for just this reason. You're not the first new person to arrive from SC. I came from the same game, and I stuck with Human in WC3 primarily because Blizzard consistently favors Human in all their RTS games. So, good choice.

Now, to keep this short, sweet, and to the point, go to WCReplays.com. When you do, go to replays, download some Human replays of top players. Also go to www.bloodmage.com and download some Angry_Korea_Man replays to see some variety in Human strategy. When you've gotten all of it committed to your brain, come back here with specific questions and bring replays of yourself playing so we can actually help you. Best of luck to you.

[cole]

Ive played angry_korea_man before. He is by far one of the gayest HUs ive ever played against.

[xodkrm]

Ive played angry_korea_man before. He is by far one of the gayest HUs ive ever played against.
Do you mean gay as in man&man or ...?

[cole]

Do you mean gay as in man&man or ...?

I mean gay as in gay strats that are completely retarted but incredibly effective. But its still funny when some people use strats like that but still manage to lose. Mass dotts for example.

[GenocideAlive]

I mean gay as in gay strats that are completely retarted but incredibly effective. But its still funny when some people use strats like that but still manage to lose. Mass dotts for example.
Frankly, I've seen him get crazy raped over and over. There's a good reason that the dude is constantly and permanently in ladder play and not in any sort of tournaments. If you can counter Bloodmage and towers, you can win.