how do you choose your heroes?

[madmarv]

i play THE ORCS... I always start with the Taurin Chieftain, then for the Farseer. I might summon the Blademaster instead of the Taurin but just for fun, in serious matches i certainly go for the Taurin first.

[EvilEggCracker]

Meh, I dont like the Chieftain much. I usually play Human. I would pick Archmage, mountain king then Paladin. Though, I used to pick Paladin, Archmage then Mountain King/ Blood Mage.

[xodkrm]

Against human, i always get Tauren Chief.
How do i pick my heros?
It depends on the map, my mood, and my play style for the day.
Very aggro maps such as turtle rock, I ALWAYS get blademaster.
Why? Bcause he owns....*evil laughter*
I get blademaster against Ne, when I want to creep hard, small map
Tauren: against ghouls, footies. Very effective if you can get him to level 5'ish before tier 3.
Farseer: I only put 1 point to wolves because I dont find it useful. Level 3 chain lighting rips casters, air & heros.
Shadow Hunter: Useful support hero. Not too effective tier 1.

[Morkeliph]

You shouldn't limit your Hero options to one set of consistent picks. Some Heroes are particularly effective against different races or in different situations. For instance, with the NE's, the KOTG isn't that great if you're going for thorns aura against other NE players, but against Orcs it's a bit better because they have many melee units. you should consider the strengths and weakness od each Hero at different points of the game and against different enemies, then develop strategies that you can implement as you play that are flexible and adaptive.

[xodkrm]

Yes you are indeed correct, Morkeliph.
But what you've said takes lots of practice...
And I dont think madmarv has had too much practice.
No offense.

[madmarv]

well maybe, I hate to play races other than the orcs, i'm more comfortable and stronger with the orcs, and i've played many many maps and all are very agressive, like 12 players each game. I always pick the taurin first in every map and against every race and then as quickly as i can i summon the farseer. the Farseer MUST be in my army, but not the first hero. again, you are right, you must choose your heroes and army depending on the map and the races you're fighting against, but everybody has his own strategies ;)

[GenocideAlive]

Well, it would seem that in later-game scenarios, the Far Seer sucks balls. Dispel is out and his low-level wolves have crap HP, and his personal HP suffers dramatically at low levels as well. If you were to get a backup for the TC, it'd have to be the SH, whom can act as a support to stomp with wards and healing wave. That might also spare you from the mass air shitstorm you KNOW is coming.

And in response to the thread, I pick my heroes based up on my knowledge of my opponent's race. I generally assume that my opponent is going to try to pull off some cookiecutter garbage, and plan accordingly. Sometimes I'm disappointed, most times not.

[Lordshadowbane]

DH always. Why? It always works.

[Yoda]

Well as what LSB said, the DH is a good cookie-cut hero for NE. I would use him most against human and Undead. Often I will get the KOTG against orc and POTM in mirror. I always make sure I know my opponents race before picking heroes.

If I was orc, I would often use the Blademaster or Far Seer first. Often the Blademaster, so I can make all their other heroes, minus the DH, other BMs, MK (storm bolts me giving them a small 5 second window to attack me), and to a much lesser extent strength heroes, redundant.

[xodkrm]

I personaly dont like the DH.
He's a great meat shield, but his skills are kind of weak.
Mana burn is annoyingly good, but the range sucks.

Btw, does anyone actually get the bladestorm for the blademaster?
I usually go for 3windwalk / 3crit.

[RedRagToAnOrc]

The general cookie-cutter hero choices go well for most matchups, but you have to take into account maps as well - Orc always goes Blademaster on LT so that he can fast-creep the Troll Berserker camps. Things like that.

Here are my general hero choices for each matchup;

Hu Mirror: AM and then FL or BeastM or Naga depending on how well I'm doing.
Hu vs Orc: AM and then FL or BeastM depending on how well I'm doing.
Hu vs Ud: AM and then Panda or MK depending on what my opponent goes.
Hu vs Ne: Tinker if I'm going for tower rush, otherwise AM/Naga with a Tier 2 peasant push.
Orc vs Hu: BM/SH on Lost Temple, normally FS/TC.
Orc Mirror: FS with a fast tech on a larger map, with FL second. Otherwise, FS/SH with slow tech and wards. BM/SH on Lost Temple.
Orc vs Ud: FS/TC with wolf/lightning harrass and Stomp on the TC for easy hero kills. BM/SH on Lost Temple.
Orc vs Ne: Depends on map and how I feel. If I'm messing, I go FS/Naga with fast tech. If I'm Tier 2 pushing, I go FS first and then TC against Archers, Naga against Hunts. If I'm 4-unit-mixing, I go FS/TC. BM/SH on Lost Temple.
Ud vs Hu: DK/Lich/CL.
Ud vs Orc: DK/Lich/CL.
Ud Mirror: I normally, contrary to ordinary strategy, go DK/Fiends, with Lich second. I'm an admirer of Philbot, and I just use mass skellies early on to tank agaisnt any Ghoul rushes, along with Coil/Burrow micro. CL third.
Ud vs Ne: DK/Lich/CL. If I'm messing, I'll go DL/Mass Ghouls.
Ne vs Hu: I tend to go DH/Panda on smaller maps and BeastM only on larger maps, for fast creep with Hunts/Archers and then late Tier 1 attack.
Ne vs Orc: DH/BeastM/Tinker. It's self explanatory.
Ne vs Ud: DH/Panda most of the time, but BeastM/Panda and DR/Panda are also options. I generally use DR on smaller maps, if I ever do.
Ne Mirror: Although I hate the strategy, and have long sought to find a perfect counter, PotM and mass Tier 1 is what I use. I generally offensive tower as well.

Basically, hero choice depends on personal preference, map, and race.

[madmarv]

regarding the blademaster, first i pick the critic strike always! because it would get me to kill a lil faster and get experience faster, and when i get to the second level i pick the windwalk and i keep it in the first level untill i must pick it up again. like, the 9th and 10th level. i use the windwalk only to forfiet, i wouldnt still hiden for long time, otherwise what use would it be? when playing blademaster, i count more on critic strike and the BLADESTORM of course. I love the DH, he's fast, BOLD, and also he's very usefull, and his 6th level is one of the strongest levels in the game, in my openion.

[xodkrm]

I only pick crit first thing when im creeping real hard.
Example: When im creeping gold mines with 2grunts, level 1 bm.
I usually get windwalk first level, crit 2nd level, windwalk 3rd level.
When I get walk rank2, I try to kill some workers, especially against undead.
I find the BM to be more effective when creeping compared to FS's wolves,
unlike what most think. I dont know why.

[madmarv]

it realy depends on the player. some players are good with the blademaster, some others are better with the TC... you got the idea. it depends also on the player's own strategy. for me i dont realy count on him, specialy against the computer!! damn the computer cheats! everytime i make a mirror they know who's the real one emmediately! not fair :( hah anyways, TC for sure are STRONGER... one bold beast.. i count on him against a whole army.

[Lordshadowbane]

Everyone likes to complicate hero choices...

[Yoda]

it realy depends on the player. some players are good with the blademaster, some others are better with the TC... you got the idea. it depends also on the player's own strategy. for me i dont realy count on him, specialy against the computer!! damn the computer cheats! everytime i make a mirror they know who's the real one emmediately! not fair :( hah anyways, TC for sure are STRONGER... one bold beast.. i count on him against a whole army.

A tip against the computer, run your real BM in using windwalk and start attacking one of their peasants. The computer will put every single peasant on militia. Rinse and repeat.

[Prozerran]

There's no magic formula to picking heroes. In fact, it's nothing more than common sense. It depends on your opening build and your strategy. If you're playing Human and plan to expo fast, get an AM with Water Elementals. If you're Orc and plan on a no rax tech to Tier 2, get the Blademaster for strong harassment. If you're NE and plan on archers and talons, DH and Priestess are good choices. And if you're UD in any match-up other than the mirror, you'll go DK/Lich/CL tri-hero abuse. In the match-up, you'll go either solo DL, DL/DK, or DL/CL.

Of course, since your hero choice is dependant on your strategy, your strategy is dependant on your match-up. Common sense.

[xodkrm]

Is it only me or does anyone lese agree that human heros are weak compared to other races?

[Lordshadowbane]

Is it only me or does anyone lese agree that human heros are weak compared to other races?
Because the MK sucks.

[SHISHKABOB]

What is Shadowhunter? Is that a different name for the blademaster or something? And what are Tiers?

[GenocideAlive]

What is Shadowhunter? Is that a different name for the blademaster or something? And what are Tiers?
...the Shadow Hunter is an Orc support hero. He has agility as his main stat and he casts Serpent Wards, Healing Wave, Hex, and Voodoo. Check it out at www.battle.net/war3/ (http://www.battle.net/war3/).

Tiers are another word for "level of tech" which is defined by the state that your Town Hall is in. If you spend ~320G 200W and select the upgrade option at your Town Hall, it will begin the ~2 minute process of turning itself into an upgraded version.

Once that upgrade is completed, you are said to be in "Tier 2" and can then make additional buildings and units. Your Town Hall is then called a "Keep", which has more hitpoints and looks slightly different. From there, you can further upgrade your "Tier 2 Keep" by the same previous process.

Finally it will complete itself into the "Tier 3 Castle" which is quite distinct looking and has gobs of HP. Additionally, with that upgrade, you are generally able to make every building and unit available to your race.

This is to keep the game stratified and coherent, giving each race their strong points in the game.

[xodkrm]

If you play ROC, the games much different.
Theres no such thing as Shadowhunter,
and teching to tiers take wwaay less time and resources.

[Morkeliph]

You know, the Shadow Hunter can be a real good first choice Hero at times as well, particularly if your opponent is going to rush. Early in the game, the loss of one unit in a nearly equal fight can turn the battle quite drastically. Say he rushes you with a Blademaster and 4 Grunts. Being able to Hex those grunts is going to help turn the battle quite a bit, especially if you get Healing Wave and are using potions from your shop. Myself, I really like the SH, I think he's an excellent Hero choice. BBV is a wicked bad ultimate also, just as long as you can protect him from being interrupted or killed. Potions of divinity work great here. When I play orc, I often get a SH, TC combination, but maybe that's because I'm unconventional.

[madmarv]

how come nobody said a thing about the TC :( he's like, THE BEST! i dont know.. when i first start playing warcraft, i didnt know what to pick and what ARE heroes.. with time i started to get used to the far seer because he dont get melee ingaged with the enemy thus he stays kinda away from the damage, this is when i started to realise the real value of the heroe, and he's fast, have agressive spells and so.. then when i started to play more bloody maps with multiple players like, 6 or above, i started to get 2 heroes not just the far seer, i didnt like the TC from the beginning because i didnt know how to play him, so i got the blademaster, and it went good with the blademaster and the far seer. when the farseer "stoped" being effective at first picked heroe, and the BM stoped being that "annoying" to the enemy, as i played more and more maps and battles and got more experienced, only then i started picking the TC, and surprisingly he was quite powerfull, i was amazed, and i never lost a war since then. i remember when i overpowered 2 armies each one from a different side and creeped the third one with the TC and the farseer, i had kinda a big army, and untill now i dont understand how i've successfully done that :D the first army i attacked on their land among the buildings, the second one came from behind and the third was just following him. i said to myself "f*ck i must get the hell outta here" but i toke my time, and toke the chance, and said wth my game is saved :D, though my lousy alieses can simply arrive at time and help me outta this miss but u know the computer.. he dont need you (haha) ;) i had like 6 taurens, 4 grunts, 2 doctors, 2 shamans, 2 troll headhunters and the TC and FS. of course the TC was above the level 6 or 7 i guess, and also the FS..

anyways, guys, i hope to see more players who apreciate and value the TC as i do.. but also, again, it depends on your strategy, though i always picked the TC in almost every game and it was quite usefull and creepy! ;)

[Lordshadowbane]

You know, the Shadow Hunter can be a real good first choice Hero at times as well, particularly if your opponent is going to rush. Early in the game, the loss of one unit in a nearly equal fight can turn the battle quite drastically. Say he rushes you with a Blademaster and 4 Grunts. Being able to Hex those grunts is going to help turn the battle quite a bit, especially if you get Healing Wave and are using potions from your shop. Myself, I really like the SH, I think he's an excellent Hero choice. BBV is a wicked bad ultimate also, just as long as you can protect him from being interrupted or killed. Potions of divinity work great here. When I play orc, I often get a SH, TC combination, but maybe that's because I'm unconventional.
SH first is only good vs Elf and is viable vs UD fienders if you rush. SH should die to that BM

how come nobody said a thing about the TC :( he's like, THE BEST! i dont know.. when i first start playing warcraft, i didnt know what to pick and what ARE heroes.. with time i started to get used to the far seer because he dont get melee ingaged with the enemy thus he stays kinda away from the damage, this is when i started to realise the real value of the heroe, and he's fast, have agressive spells and so.. then when i started to play more bloody maps with multiple players like, 6 or above, i started to get 2 heroes not just the far seer, i didnt like the TC from the beginning because i didnt know how to play him, so i got the blademaster, and it went good with the blademaster and the far seer. when the farseer "stoped" being effective at first picked heroe, and the BM stoped being that "annoying" to the enemy, as i played more and more maps and battles and got more experienced, only then i started picking the TC, and surprisingly he was quite powerfull, i was amazed, and i never lost a war since then. i remember when i overpowered 2 armies each one from a different side and creeped the third one with the TC and the farseer, i had kinda a big army, and untill now i dont understand how i've successfully done that :D the first army i attacked on their land among the buildings, the second one came from behind and the third was just following him. i said to myself "f*ck i must get the hell outta here" but i toke my time, and toke the chance, and said wth my game is saved :D, though my lousy alieses can simply arrive at time and help me outta this miss but u know the computer.. he dont need you (haha) ;) i had like 6 taurens, 4 grunts, 2 doctors, 2 shamans, 2 troll headhunters and the TC and FS. of course the TC was above the level 6 or 7 i guess, and also the FS..
Try using indent to make it easier to read. Now, the fact that you had taurens/docs/shams and all that stuff, along w/ a level 6 TC already makes your strategy lose its value. TC has a hard time creeping. And his mana is low. Second hero= TC although TC can be used if your massing HH's.

[RedRagToAnOrc]

As LSB said, Tauren Chieftain at a decent level of play is used as a second hero for Stomp (easy hero kills and extra FFing time in battles) or Shockwave (against low HP units such as Archers). The people you were playing must have been absolutely terrible to lose two on one - going into a battle like that is suicide.

The only valid option as a TC first hero is when massing Headhunters. This is normally done in 2s games where one player can tank with Huntresses or Grunts while the other Stomps and focus fires down units.

You may enjoy playing Tauren Chieftain at your level, and that's perfectly fine. But it's hardly ever used as a first hero at a good level of play.

[xodkrm]

Actually, the TC is used as first hero by lots of pros verses human.

[RedRagToAnOrc]

Actually, the TC is used as first hero by lots of pros verses human.

Really? Can you provide some links for me? I've never seen it done.

[xodkrm]

I dont have any links right now, but ill try to find some.
Most that ive found are out dated (last patch).