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Geno
11-29-2005, 5:18 AM
So I know you should write a guide at level 60. But you know what? A lot of people often say "Yea, you're level 60. You can do anything, do it well, and not care what you did to get there!"

Guess what. This isn't a guide like that. Not even close. I'm speaking from the perspective of a level 34 and 2/3 Druid, currently being played on the Cenarius server. I'll write this as of now, and tack on more as I go. Please, if you have comments about your "OMFG LVL 60 PWNAG3 DRUID LOL," I'd rather them go elsewhere. This is a guide geared towards those wanting to hear about good and bad points about being midlevel, which will be more than half your game on the alliance side (Seeing as how levels 28ish to about 36-38ish has no good instances, along with few quests to do if you've had party members help you with hard quests fast).

Druids can be one of two races, one on either side. The Night Elf, or the Tauren. Both have the same type of things available, and have no spell differences. However, the Tauren possess "War Stomp," a 2 second stun, as well as a 5% health bonus, while Night Elves possess "Shadowmeld," which does two things. One is to... Well... Shadowmeld. The other is a passive "Better Sneak" addon. If you read the tooltip, you find out that in Cat form or as a Rogue (The first part applies, obviously), you have better stealth. This is *handy* from the perspective I play. As well as that, they gain Wisp form. Quite handy.

Either race you go can do anything well. If you had to pick the 'better' of things to do, a Taruen would make a better Feral Bear, while the Night Elf would do better in the Feral Cat. You can do either, but those are what the two would be 'geared towards' more.

My build so far? Omen of Clarity Feral. What does this mean? I'm based around two different things, expecially as a cat. First: Agility whoring. Agility not only raises your attack power a little bit, it also increases your dodge and critical chances. As it stands now with my gear and Mark of the Wild buff going (+6 stats), I gain upwards of 16% Critical chance with around a 15.5%, almost 16% dodge chance. For a mid-level range and no "twinked" gear, I'd say this is pretty decent. I'm able to critical every few swings, as well as dodge a lot of blows. Plus, with Stealth, I can get right into combat as a Cat, not worrying about the range dodges that you have to pull sometimes against ranged mobs.

Omen of Clarity was mentioned already. What is this move? I'll tell you. For a smaller cost of 120 mana (At my level >.>), I gain this nifty buff called... Guess? Omen of Clarity! It allows me a chance one every single melee swing (Including Swipe, Maul, Claw, Rake, etc) to give me a possible Druid Clearcast state. Now wait a minute! A DRUID clearcast state? What do I mean?! Well let me explain. Mages and Priests and Warlocks... And maybe a few other classes can gain "Clearcasting." That means that their next mana cost is reduced to ZERO. Nothing. Zilch. That means they get a free shot. Well guess what? The Druid clearcast is better. You not only get just Mana reductions... But in Bear form? Rage is free. As a cat? Energy is free. Yes, that means the clearcast benefits ANY form whatsoever, and can work with just about ANY move! When 1.9 is released, this will even include finisher moves for the cat, and a couple bear moves that *haven't* been added to that clearcast list... But will!

So guess what. That means you can instantly hit another move, be it a free heal, free rake, free maul... Whatever you please! Right then. Bam. Of course, as some moves have cast, that isn't ignored. But the cost sure as heck is! Omen of Clarity at lower levels is a godsend, expecially as a cat with your 1.0 attack speed all the time. Bears don't really benefit from going 11 points into the Balance tree to get it, nor do casters. It only proc's on melee swings. But a cat? That's like free shot heaven. I've calculated with my Druid about how many free shots I get. While in battle with enemies constantly, I get around 15 to twenty free shots off before my buff wears. Now let me see. Let's go low end. 15 free shots. Using a low cost move, such as Rake which is 35 rage to me. That means I end up saving time for 525 energy, or in seconds, give or take, 20-25 seconds! That's nuts, isn't it?! Or even better. One of my favorite moves. If I'm at mid-level health in battle, and feel I need a recharge? Shift, Rejuv, shift. I only pay for the shifting, which sadly, can't work with clearcasting. However, the rejuv is free, and recharges me for a few seconds, giving me a quick boost for free. And I go right back into fighting! That saves me mana for after the fight. Or if I see an ally drop in health, I can shift, go to a Regrowth or even a (Hefty timer on 3.5 cast time) Healing Touch spell and heal them a lot, then go right back into cat, without worrying "Do I have enough mana to do both?"

Your mana normally rejuvinates at it's normal pace while in battle as a cat. You're not casting "Spells" as a cat, but rather, energy moves. This means that once you cast a spell, shift to cat, the 5 second timer goes, then your mana rejuves. This often times can leave you in a predicament if you can't figure out what your mana would be at. But clearcasting can save you! Let's say you aggro a mob, and find out you have an add. Oh hell! You can't take both, and you know it. Well, you fight a while as a cat. You just shifted, knowing you could die. But what's this?! You hit clearcast! Holy crap! Shift back, Regrowth, try and shift. Uh oh! Out of mana! But guess what? You're not screwed! Swing melee a while. If you hit another clearcast, throw another rejuv on top of that regrowth. That way, you have double the heal, and you can still gain back mana at a normal rate, since Omen DOESN'T INTERFERE WITH MANA GAIN! Yes, that's right, you still gain mana, even after casting your clearcast! Nice, isn't it? Once you shift back, kick their butts and be glad! ^.^

So yes. That's what my build is focused on. Fast attacks, lots of dodge and critical, as well as free shots here and there. Now for what it plays like.

In the early game (Levels 1-13 for me), I leveled up in the NE newbie area and part of Auberdine. Why only part way, though? Guess what. NE quests suck. Horribly. They have some of the worst and longest, and drawn out quests. I only returned once to that area, which was to do both my poison and water quests at once. I could hold off on "Cure Poison," only because I went to the human lands to get quests for Deadmines. Once I hit 16, though, I ran back, finished both quests, then ran back, leveling up as I went. I reccommend hitting at least "Honored" reputation with Darnassus before you leave, if only for the reason that it'll be what you need for your mount. No way in hell you'll pull of "Exalted" anywhere before 40, nor will you do it even with Darnassus. Therefore, just move on to human lands afterwards.

From 13-20, I pulled off all the quests I could in Westfall, followed by some Deadmine runs to get equipment. I ended up finding a blue staff in there (The name eludes me) that I used from that level up until about 32ish. Why? It had tons of +Int, along with spirit and another stat. That was rather handy to have, and the damage was decent. It was my friend until I got my maul of +Stam / +Agi later... But that's in due time. The Deadmines are good levels and drops, as well as wool for 8 slot bags if you haven't gotten them already. If you get lucky, you can get a few high priced drops in there, such as Cookie's tenderiser, and if you have no "Awesome" gear, try and get the Defias leather set. I wore 3 pieces of it for a time until I got better gear overall. Don't stick with Defias just because it's a set. Sure, it's cool to get... But if you can find better, by all means, TAKE IT! Duh!

After pulling level 20ish, I went to Redridge and did that deal. Boy, were those fun quest lines. I play a Skinner / Leatherworker, and found PLENTY of nice things to skin there, including dragon whelps to make some good cloaks, armor and such that I could sell for decent profit, as well as level my skill. Beyond that, the place has good level mobs and a few places you can camp the spawn quite literally forever... Or until the server goes down :P (I'll share if you ask). Getting up to around 25, I realized many of the quests were getting to be higher level fast (There's about 6 or 7 quests you can solo, followed by about 5 or 6 you *must* party with unless you level a while), so I decided against the party. I only have a few friends to contact, so I moved on...

...To Duskwood! Duskwood was my b*tch. Skinable money dropping werewolf creatures. Those things are gods to most Druids that skin. Fast, free kills, as well as cash and leather. Light leather? Make it Medium! Medium leather? Score! Heavy Leather? W00t for a good drop! A lot of the quest lines there are killing quests, as well as FedEx at the same time, and can be completed two or three at a time, although the run from the town all the way to Raven kind of sucked... But if you spec Feral to get your speed / dodge skill first, it's not so bad. However, I went for Omen first, which slowed me a little bit. But once you do get Speed... Oh boy, is that fun! :D

After tottally smiting 90% of Darkshire, I went back to Redridge, finding 90% of those quests easy. Why? Cat form. Prowl. Improved Prowl talent. You can sneak around just about anything there when you match the level or even are a level or two down. I pulled that off many times, solo'ing nearly everything out there, minus the stupid "Kill this level ** elite" thing that's off in the forest... God, he gave me hell... But a group of me, another druid, and a pair of rogues (Stealth FTW!) dropped him in no time flat, all of us completing the quest, and still keep in contact now for quests similar to it (Whee! Friendship among stealthers ^.^). That was fun and all, and from there, I moved into Gadgetzan at about level 30 to 32, completing everything so far, except for the final boss killing (Which our group has died 10 feet from him every time due to someone stupid luring half the level to kill us. Where's "Vanish" when we need it? >.<).

From Gadgetzan to now, I did a couple quests in Altari, then moved from there to my current place, Desolace. Why? There's noone there. Noone levels there. The quests are "Stupid" and "Overrated" among many members of my guild. I don't complain though. Centaurs are easy to drop, give me about 200+ exp a kill, and I get about 3000+ exp per quest, and still claiming as I go.

Now... That's a long winded way of leveling, methinks. Sure, it's only "Halfway" through the game, give or take, but it's one of the most important parts. Getting to know your character. Speaking of character... Let's go into your tools, shall we?

First: You're a Druid. You can do anything. Rogue moves? You have cat. Warrior or Pally tank? You've got bear. Priestage needing a call? Hit up the Healing Touch, Regrowth, and Rejuv. But wait, you need to pick off mobs like a Mage or Warlock? Starfire / Moonfire are saviors. Oh... But you need to debuff a little? Farie fire. Boom. Range? Pfft. F*ck range. You still have Starfire and Moonfire (The latter is an instant cast, DoT with damage move). Nice, isn't it? You can duplicate nearly every single class in the game... Although you can't do them *all* just as good... You can claim bullsh*t and do a lot of them pretty dang well!

My build, however, relies on the skill "Cat form," but until then, let me explain what you've got to do (In my eyes) to get ready.

First: Learn to heal. And when to heal. Healing is a main priorty at lower levels, because you want to test your limits, finding tough mobs for quests, and finding your spot. Healing is essential to you and party members. Learn to find your heal timing. Regrowth / Rejuv before charging into battle is a savior, and the HoT moves have helped me against elites twice my level, letting me actually KILL them. Even that pesky reef shark thing as I did my water quest. Yes, I killed him. And he's level 19. And I was level 16. And I killed him. Boo f*cking ja. Talent? No. Careful planning with heals. Sure, it took a while and some sheer luck, but I got it.

Second: Know your mana, how fast it comes back, and timing of spells. Don't spam Moonfire. Let the DoT sink in while you take a few melee swings and such. Chip off at their damage and give them a target. The damage is done over 12 seconds. That means that you have 4 pulses of damage before it's gone. Wait until that last pulse about hits, and jam the button. It takes a second to follow through. Once you get the timing, that last chunk comes off and the next DoT sets in. Beautiful when executed properly. Trust me. But remember: Mana takes time to come back to you. Learn your limit.

Third: Don't "Stick" to just one form. Cat, Bear, or Caster. I have, on occasion, switched to Bear form when we needed a tank. Caster when we needed a healer, Cat when we needed reconnosence or DPS. All three forms are versitile for things. Trust me. I have been told I heal like a priest in parties, even with no points in Resto. What does that tell you? That I'm skilled? No. It tells you that I know what to expect, and how to play. If you have to, ask lowbies if you want to help them with Deadmines. Sure, it takes a while, and you might have one or two die on accident. But they have a higher level, and healer. This means that you can learn your limits there. Trust me, although sounding mean by saying "If one dies, don't worry," really. Don't worry. It's not a long instance, and they can run back. If you do that in Gadgetzan, though, feel the smite. That 5 minute corpse run, followed by a possible respawn *reeeealy* sucks to some.

Fourth: Find a pattern and go. My common pattern? Cast my buffs. Get into cat form. Stealth. Cast order: Ravage, Swipe, Rake, Swipe, Rake, Rip / Ferocious bite (Depending on how much life remains. 90% of the time, Ferocious, but if they have more than 40% life, go with Rip. Then tack on Rake / Swipe / Ferocious bite to finish them after the DoT sets in a bit ). This means that I prowl up, do tons of damage. Then begin combat with a heavy hit, following up with a DoT while my energy recharges. Once it's up, swipe 'em, then throw the DoT back on them, since the first is almost done (9 seconds isn't long). That leaves me 5 combo points to use my finisher at full potential. Rip is for bleedables and DoT. Early on, your only form of blowing Combo points, but it helps. Use it! Even if it doesn't work long, it does damage nonetheless. But Ferocious comes in later, which is a godsend for massive damage. It does insane damage based on combo points (About equal to rip's DoT) then burns the rest of your energy doing 1.0 damage of it (At lower levels) into damage as well. Handy, isn't it? Massive damage to any target. It hurts on energy... But it's worth it.

So that's my idea for my quick strikes. Omen usually proc's once or twice during a fight, speeding that process up, which is nice. And my dodge / critical chances don't let me down :D

So what did I do at lower levels? Bear form? Caster? Mix? YES! Mix! Caster early on to put on DoT's, as well as throw rejuv on before I hit bear. Then I mauled them (Literally), dropping their life down slowly. The rage kind of hurts since I suggest getting omen first for when you get cat form immidiately, but whatever you pick works. But that 15 rage is sometimes hard to earn. No worries, though, since bear is a tank in it's own right, and allows you to do damage, as well as do things like stun (Bash) and pull aggro (Growl).

So what've I covered... Cat form, and my spec... Druids and what to do... Tools of the trade... What you can do... Levels and grinding... Hmm... I might have missed something... What have I missed...?

How about parties? Lots of parties ask for healers. You may be a feral spec, such as me. But many parties enjoy having a Druid as a healer for a few reasons. One, you can heal over time. This means you can throw on a warrior at half life a healing. It heals them slowly, keeping them there, allowing you to throw bigger heals on your squishies, such as the Leeroy mage, or the stupid rogue that just aggro'd too many mobs. Yes, a Druid healer can be a godsend. Even some people concider it better than a Priest for healing in some places. Just depends on who's spec'ed what... ;)

Try everything. Try bear tanking. Try cat DPS'ing. Try healing. Try casting. I seriously reccomend you doing everything until you find your *favorite* thing to do. Mine? Beating the snot out of enemies for 50+ damage every 1 second, then doing massive 85+ shots every other second, while DoT'ing them for 15+ points every 3 seconds, dealing a massive 500+ critical every twenty seconds, and still having life leftover to take aggro off the priest with fast swings and heavy damage, as well as a high thread back shot (Shred, FTW!).

Yes... Druids thus far into the game definately have plusses... But... Disadvantages...?! YES! We have those. So far, let me throw out my low level complaints:

Quests can be either really hard or really easy. Druids can do a lot... But lower level ones aren't perfect. They won't be 'up to par' with things. Such as the lack of cat form until 20, as well as lack of travel form until 30.

Speed isn't a priority, nor is heavy damage. Melee is reduced to slow staves that I've seen, or training something else... But why train a 1H weapon? You won't get a decent off hand placeholder until somewhere in the 15-20 range... And by then, you'll probably want a 2H staff for stat buffs or mace for damage. Go with staff or mace and stick with it. Make *sure* to train mace if you go feral, though, since you'll rely on that for a lot of things! But always keep a Staff in your bank.

I'd suggest to train both after you get a level. Mostly because if you want to switch builds in later game, you'll be able to immidiately hit your switch and be good to go! Trust me, I trained my mace at the same time as my staff. I finally got a good 2H mace, and only had to hit Gnomer to swing at some elites for maybe 2 minutes, getting another 2 minutes, getting the last few points I needed to be good. If you miss a level or two, no worries. But five or six? Train to be safe.

Also, healing isn't close to a priests until you get Regrowth around level... Twelve? Fourteen? I think it's twelve, but I could be wrong. Whatever the case, regrowth is a quick heal with HoT tacked on, stackable with Rejuv. It is about equal to healing as Healing touch most of the time until you hit your 20's, and the cost is equal, if not, a little lower. However, once you hit your 20's, Healing Touch outdoes it by a few hundred points. But I *still* recommend for a mid-battle heal with Regrowth, if only for a faster cast, and HoT to back you up, expecially if cast with Rejuv, an instant cast with no delay. Always go with your faster moves when being hit. That'll save you from being screwed by cast delays.

I've used a mod to watch my cast times. It displays any and all slowdowns I've gotten. While in Gnomer, being hit by 2 mobs at once, I cast Rejuv. No delay. Bam. Instant. I cast Regrowth. 2 seconds + 1.8 seconds. It almost doubled the time. I cast Healing touch. 3.5 + 4.4 seconds. I *more* than doubled the cast time for about the same price and only a little more healing. Tell me... Which would you go with? Think about it, then answer. You'll understand.

Another big problem I had was with mana issues. Without +Int, you're toast, even as a shifter. Why? YOu still need to buff and heal occasionally. Even if you have high spirit while shifted, you'll still fall short with overall mana. I keep on a pair of rings. One is Agi, one is Int. I have given up a slot that I could have +3 or more Agi on for more Int that saves me moreso than the minor damage and crit / dodge, but gives me tons more mana leniency when healing or buffing, allowing me to buff all 5 people with MotW, Thorns, wait my 5 seconds for the regen, regen about 5 more, and shift. Total time? About 30 seconds to buff and Catify. Not too bad if you ask me. Without that int? It's around a minute to minute and a half. Trust me, Int is helpful, even for shifters.

So I think that covers all the major points. I feel that if I hit level 60, I'd go into this long detail about how the class is *so* worth it to build up, yadayadayada... So why explain it then when I've long since forgotten my beginning, when I can talk now!

Here's to 34 and 2/3 levels, and here's to another successful 35 and 1/3! :D

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

Ender
11-29-2005, 5:20 PM
Excellent guide, Geno. This is getting stickied, and I'm going to change the name to something more official. In addition, as this is the first of the guides to go up, let me make this declaration to everyone: Anything like what KP said in a guide thread is deleted instantly. This is your only warning. Don't do it.

kongurous
11-29-2005, 6:49 PM
Anything like what KP said in a guide thread is deleted instantly. This is your only warning. Don't do it.

How can we know what he said, if you deleted his post?

Geno
11-29-2005, 7:06 PM
How can we know what he said, if you deleted his post?

He made a comment about how his character can "One shot" me instantly if I joined his server.

This guide was meant to *not* include anything of level 60 smitings, nor what 'uber godly chants lol' to put on. I use normal stuff, which any level 30ish can obtain legitimately. No twinking, nothing. It's made to be an "All around" build, meaning it can do just about anything well, with an emphasis on PvM Feral.

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

Ender
11-29-2005, 7:34 PM
How can we know what he said, if you deleted his post?

Good point.

His disobeyed Geno's request. He said something about "Let me one shot your druid then we'll chat."

Stuff like that won't be tolerated.

killer-penguin
12-01-2005, 5:08 PM
Druids can be one of two races, one on either side. The Night Elf, or the Tauren. Both have the same type of things available, and have no spell differences. However, the Tauren possess "War Stomp," a 2 second stun, as well as a 5% health bonus, while Night Elves possess "Shadowmeld," which does two things. One is to... Well... Shadowmeld. The other is a passive "Better Sneak" addon. If you read the tooltip, you find out that in Cat form or as a Rogue (The first part applies, obviously), you have better stealth. This is *handy* from the perspective I play. As well as that, they gain Wisp form. Quite handy.
From a testability standpoint the 'bonus to stealth' is nonexistent. Trust me this is what we do in my guild. We sit there and test abilities for a week, focussing on one thing. I can see a ne in stealth just as well as I can see a tauren in stealth, maybe they will fix this at some point but right now there is just no difference it is a tooltip with absolutely no validity.

As for my failed attempt at humor. My bad.

If you have to, ask lowbies if you want to help them with Deadmines. Sure, it takes a while, and you might have one or two die on accident. But they have a higher level, and healer. This means that you can learn your limits there. Trust me, although sounding mean by saying "If one dies, don't worry," really. Don't worry. It's not a long instance, and they can run back. If you do that in Gadgetzan, though, feel the smite. That 5 minute corpse run, followed by a possible respawn *reeeealy* sucks to some.

I don't see how helping lowbies through an instance that requires relatively no class makeup or skill can help you heal. If you had said rfk I would've definately agreed. Or gnomeregan because IMO gnomeregan is one of the hardest instances until the late 40's. (where you do uldaman.) At level 25-30 you can go to deadmines and basically spam HoT's and heal your entire party. Or you could just go into cat form and beat the crap out of stuff. I'd say (and this is only my view don't hang me for it) that you need to party with a group your level in an instance your level to really get a handle on mana conservation and heal priority.

Shift, Rejuv, shift. I only pay for the shifting, which sadly, can't work with clearcasting. However, the rejuv is free, and recharges me for a few seconds, giving me a quick boost for free. And I go right back into fighting! That saves me mana for after the fight. Or if I see an ally drop in health, I can shift, go to a Regrowth or even a (Hefty timer on 3.5 cast time) Healing Touch spell and heal them a lot, then go right back into cat, without worrying "Do I have enough mana to do both?"
obviously this isn't a 60 guide but I'd just like to point out that this gets even better at higher levels because there is a trinket in BWL that allows druids a free shift.

Ender
12-01-2005, 5:30 PM
Actually, I would. This discussion is closed.

kongurous
12-01-2005, 5:51 PM
Actually, I would. This discussion is closed.

Don't look like it.

Ender
12-01-2005, 6:42 PM
I'm seeing no link in here, nor in the forum. Care to enlighten me?

Sikawtic
12-01-2005, 6:47 PM
I'm confused.

kongurous
12-01-2005, 6:57 PM
I'm seeing no link in here, nor in the forum. Care to enlighten me?

You said this discussion was closed. I thought that meant you were going to lock the thread...

Ender
12-01-2005, 9:36 PM
Discussion on druids isn't closed. I was asking for where this mysterious link to a gold-service is so I can delete it. Discussion on what I can and can not do is over.

killer-penguin
01-10-2006, 2:20 PM
geno are you still feral specced in the mid 50's or did you go for a more group oriented build?

Geno
01-11-2006, 10:11 AM
geno are you still feral specced in the mid 50's or did you go for a more group oriented build?

I stayed Feral until about 40ish, maybe 41. I forget exactly. Omen of Clarity, along with the +Combo points on crits with cat form, along with about a 20% chance to dodge and 23ish% chance to crit was nice. That, coupled with Omen, gave me nearly limitless combo points on some enemies.

My favorite was when I ran through Deadmines with a friend, just for the fun of it (They played a rogue, one level below me), I ran into murder VanCleef. First hit, Crit + Proc. Did my DoT, Crit, then did another Claw. That burnt only 40 + Free swing + 35 Energy (20 regain) + 40 energy's worth of shots. I don't call that too bad, do you? And I've already got 5 combos! Threw my DoT on, and wailed on him some more.

During that whole VC fight, I think the proc went off about 8 times, give or take. That's counting against his minions. Between the two of us, neither hit half life, and with both our dodge rates through the roof, we weren't taking hits any time soon.

I've since Respec'ed to a full Restoration build, however, I know what my End Game build is exactly going to be (My guild almost 'demands' it, as I'm currently outhealing level 60 Priests in some runs >.>)

Zero Balance, Eleven Feral, Forty Restoration.

here. (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/druids2/talents.html?0000000000000000500050100000000050550 0155015251)

Sure, some call it 'overkill.' But you know what? With this very build (Actually, a more 'full restoration' oriented build, more on that later), I've outhealed Priests, and always gotten back into groups before. Hell, Even without Feral Charge in the build, I can tank in bear form sometimes, and I know how to pull aggro from healers fast. Growl, Challenging Roar, and spamming a few quick moves, such as Moonfire in caster, or Swipe / Maul in Bear... If I'm not healing, I'm definately taking the blows, because even in Sunken Temple, wearing all of my healing gear? I still can out-tank some of the Warriors by having more than 4.2k armor with my buff alone.

Thing is, currently I've respec'ed to Feral again. Why? Lots of reasons. You'll find the fact that I still wear my healing gear hilarious. But guess what? I outdamaged a rogue three levels down from me the other day. I know, I know... Three levels down means a lot! But you gotta think about this... By the time you hit about level 50ish (Currently 53), you tend to realize that gear is becoming more of a factor. A well geared up, blue item carrying Rogue will almost always outdamage a green wearing Rogue, even if the Green rogue is a little better than the Blue. Why? More stats to help. Every few points contributes somewhere, and being the Agi whore that I was when I first started, nowing being an Int whore? I'm seeing less crits.

But I still somehow have maintained by 15% dodge and 15% crit (Mostly talents) while I'm a kitty cat. The build currently involves Leader of the Pack, as well as Feral Charge and Thick hide... Along with improved Mark of the Wild, and Improved Enrage (!). Many dub that a 'worthless' talent... However, getting 30 rage before battle? That's even more than a Warrior can get. I Feral Charge, immidiately spamming Maul, and I lose 15 rage off the bat, but I stun, as well as heavy hit the enemy, putting a ton of aggro on... So much, in fact, that a mage has used Arcane Missles on it (Not sure which rank, but they were 51, if tthat says anything), and they've not gotten aggro. Through the battle, I spammed Maul on the enemy, re-enraging in the last few seconds of it to get the killing blow, and I had no trouble keeping the squishy from dying.

Now... Tell me... In all Int gear, how many Druids do you see able to tank as well as a Warrior? Basically, you need to know how the class works, as well as what move is right for certain situations.

But as I said previously, my build before this Feral was Full Restoration. Nothing anywhere else. I just hit 53 before the Respec, and got the second of three parts of my Wildheart set, being the Belt. My mana has since skyrocketed to nearly 5.9k in the Feral build, about 5.4 or 5.5k I believe in the Restoration (Check the Talent Tree for Feral, "Heard of the Wild," and you'll see why that holds true).

One of my freinds, whom we'll call "Fingle" (Not real char name) has a Druid currently. He was spec'ed Feral up until recently, showing me how to outdamage rogues 2 levels up on him, and I must say, I was impressed. Since then, though, I've been teaching him how to heal. Between the two of us, we were very capapble Druids, leveling at about the same pace (He was two - three levels up all the time, but we kept pace). The build at endgame he's going for is a Zero, Thirty, Twenty one build, focused on Nature's Swiftness for healing, then getting Heart of the Wild in the Feral Tree. This offers him 20% more base mana, as well as the Ability to heal instantly. Both talents are amazingly useful, helping the Druid to do well both in Feral and Caster form.

My outlook from here on out is to grind my *ss off in Sunken Temple, and following that WPL and EPL, which are both Argent Dawn whoring areas. Once I reach Friendly with them, the world is my burrito.

I've also been in the process of leveling a mage (Currently 15), and finding out a lot of the reasons I hate mages stems from their moves. Nothing that allows you to "Ditch" aggro. Not like a Druid with Cower... Not like a Priest with Fade... Not like a Warrior who switches to a dual wielding Fury stance (Ouch)... Not like a Pally, who goes into a bubble and stands still for about 10 minutes, while somehow surviving... Mages don't have that button. The best they get is "Ice Block" and that doesn't come unless you're Ice spec'ed. Hell, that's near pointless to my full Arcane build... -.-

But indeed, once I level that mage up, I'll let you know how that build goes about level 30, then tell you once I get to higher levels, as well.

But the Feral Druid build? It works at any time. Even now, wearing int gear, I can still pull Feral out of my butt, and pull off being a good Druid. It's just knowledge of the class, and communication. Don't do something stupid, and use your moves wisely... And it's all good ;)

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

Incantrix
01-11-2006, 2:32 PM
Geno, do you do much pvp? With your druid, or your mage? Mages don't start having serious trouble until lvl 60 in pvp. Most people don't believe it because they only see mages with two certain epic trinkets that give them insane damage every three minutes.

The lack of an aggro dump is annoying, but you eventually learn to live with it. Even without it, before lvl 60 I could still outdmg anyone and not pull aggro. If you're doing full arcane spec, and are using arcane missiles, (which I would recommend against anyway) it might be useful to get arcane subtlety, though I've never tried it. /shrug

A lot of people are trying to get Blizzard to give mages an aggro dump, but I don't know if it'll happen. My hope is that they make blink do it.

Geno
01-11-2006, 4:42 PM
Geno, do you do much pvp? With your druid, or your mage? Mages don't start having serious trouble until lvl 60 in pvp. Most people don't believe it because they only see mages with two certain epic trinkets that give them insane damage every three minutes.

The lack of an aggro dump is annoying, but you eventually learn to live with it. Even without it, before lvl 60 I could still outdmg anyone and not pull aggro. If you're doing full arcane spec, and are using arcane missiles, (which I would recommend against anyway) it might be useful to get arcane subtlety, though I've never tried it. /shrug

A lot of people are trying to get Blizzard to give mages an aggro dump, but I don't know if it'll happen. My hope is that they make blink do it.

Part of the class is learning how to ditch aggro, from what I've seen. And I don't do much PvP on Cenarius if only for the fact that a good majority of people that PvP play using Bad manners (Read as: Twinking / Fearing / Using 'cheap shot' moves that either can't be resisted, or using trinkets that you shouldn't get at those levels, etc), and comparing that to Boulderfist (A full PvP server), it's pointless for me to even try until I hit 60. Although there are people on Boulderfist that PvP with twinks or those mentioned that I see on Cenarius... Most of them are almost pushed away from society, and most guilds won't even allow them in.

Needless to say, my characters are mostly based on what I want. Not what the "WoW poulous" wants out of the class, save the healing on the Druid. Most mages spec for something 'worthwhile' in the end, however, if I build my mage properly and get her high enough level, I should be able to see her get some good damage output while not taking aggro.

I'm also not a 'stupid mage,' in where I pull aggro, realize it, and fire off more shots, nor run around. I stand still, taking it like a champ best I can while waiting for a Hunter or pet to come around and pull the aggro off. Or if neither exist, a secondary class that can take the hits better, such as a Rogue or Druid. Trust me, even while playing healer, if a mage takes aggro and I can't heal them fast enough? I'll throw a moonfire / Insect swarm on, trying to pull it off them long enough so the mage can live and keep trying to kill it, all while I heal myself over them. Most of the time, I have more life than the squishies (Save a Warlock), and also take less of a hit than they do.

Call me crazy, but the way I play has worked thus far *Shrug*

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

P.S. Trinkets that work every 3 minutes for 15 seconds < Trinkets that are always active, and over time do more for me.

My personal opinion. Why have to 'activate' a trinket, and pray I don't get resisted? I could just have a +Mana or +Damage trinket on me constantly. Sure, one or two might get resisted... But it's always active ;)

Incantrix
01-12-2006, 12:02 PM
I agree, though I was really just doing some wishful thinking. The two crazy trinkets mages can get are Talisman of Ephemeral Power and Zandalarian Hero Charm. Talisman increases the damage and healing done by spells by up to 175 for 15 seconds. Hero Charm increases it by 350 for first spell that decreases by like 75 dmg every spell.

You're right in saying that these suck for most play. A trinket thats always on is way better for PvE, but these things are what allow mages to get 3000+ dmg crits. Especially when coupled with Arcane Power.

killer-penguin
01-13-2006, 2:39 AM
Just remember that in endgame its not so much about how well you heal, but how well you conserve mana. If you can top up everyone in the party's hp (or all the mt's or whatever it is your job to heal) that's great. But if you run out of mana when Sulf/Garr/Geddon or whoever it is you are facing is at 10%, you haven't done your job well. Grab the handy mods that help cancel heals if the person you are trying to heal is at like 70% or w/e. I'm not exactly the most accomplished healer (my 60's are lock/mage/rogue and soon to have a hunter) but I have dicked around with em for abit and realized stuff about heal aggro and the effectiveness of hot's. I know you put a lot of thought into everything you do in game and thats good just make sure that your not just spamming the top rank heal :P.

Anyone who pays attention throughout a party run can outheal the slackass 60 healer, in fact most endgame healers suck balls in party's because they slack like everyone else.

Geno
01-13-2006, 12:45 PM
Just remember that in endgame its not so much about how well you heal, but how well you conserve mana. If you can top up everyone in the party's hp (or all the mt's or whatever it is your job to heal) that's great. But if you run out of mana when Sulf/Garr/Geddon or whoever it is you are facing is at 10%, you haven't done your job well. Grab the handy mods that help cancel heals if the person you are trying to heal is at like 70% or w/e. I'm not exactly the most accomplished healer (my 60's are lock/mage/rogue and soon to have a hunter) but I have dicked around with em for abit and realized stuff about heal aggro and the effectiveness of hot's. I know you put a lot of thought into everything you do in game and thats good just make sure that your not just spamming the top rank heal :P.

Anyone who pays attention throughout a party run can outheal the slackass 60 healer, in fact most endgame healers suck balls in party's because they slack like everyone else.

Thing is 70% is too low for me. As a Druid, Regrowth and Rejuvination are my best heals. Rejuvination gives less aggro than Healing Touch, and even with a Crit, it gives about the same amount. Rejuvination is low aggro. If I don't crit with Regrowth, that's fine. I still heal, and give HoT, as well as not take aggro. If I heal with Rejuvination, I win because I don't take aggro. If I crit on Regrowth, I win, because they heal for about the same as my Healing Touch, as well as get that Rejuvination effect, which isn't that bad, concidering most of the time they'll hit 100%... So when they take a shot, they're back at full already!

Priests heal the best when their party member is at 50% or less. Druids heal in the 70% or less range, due to their "Rejuvination" spell. Sure, Priests have Lesser Heal... And Renew... But y'know, when talent points are put together with nothing else (All healing spells get their +whatevers, including Regrow and Rejuv), they heal about the same. When all talents are put together, Mana / time / heal cost of the spell stacked against each other, Druids actually have Priests outdone when it comes to Mini Heals (This is comparing Regrowth against its counter, Lesser Heal, both speed heals). When it comes to the greater heals (Greater Heal vs Healing Touch), the Priest barely walks away with it. Why? Casting time. That's the big one. Also, they don't have one of the Druids' best assets: Nature's Swiftness.

I also know you can set lower level heals. But why set 6 or 7 keys for healing, sometimes possibly getting them confused? I set four buttons. Healing Touch, the highest level (Or second highest, if the Warrior in our group doesn't have more than 2.5k HP), Regrowth's highest Level, and Rejuvination's Highest level. Lastly, I put Nature's Swiftness on my bar, and I'm all set.

Now I'll admit, I haven't played a Priest. I'll also admit, my Druid isn't level 60.

To the previous two points might I also remind you: Most Priests don't play a Druid. Priests get shafted as Healbots in most, if not, all higher level instances, and don't want to play a Druid, inevitably doing the same thing again. Druids, however, may play a Priest before they hit 60, because not all Druids have to be a semi-healbot until 60. And yes, I've built a Priest up to level 18 before (Boulderfist Horde), and that one was fun. The healing, however, felt almost the exact same as my Druid at those levels. Not much difference.

Basically, Druids and Priests are comparable. A Druid who knows what's going on and how to heal could very well outheal a Priest. The thing is, you can't really compare the two in the end (Although it might sound like what I did). Priests are the best at bringing people from near nothing, while Druids are able to heal towards the beginning and middle of the battle. As for AoE healing? Just depends on your situation. Do you need the healing RIGHT now? Or do you need the healing over 10 seconds?

Different classes, different jobs. Although healing's the name of the game, how to heal is a different job entirely.

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

killer-penguin
01-14-2006, 12:56 AM
Yeah I guess you're right. I've only ever really party or raid healed on a shamang/healbot so I don't really know as much about hot's as you would.

Sikawtic
01-22-2006, 8:39 PM
In your post... you mentioned wisp form being another plus...

so I want to know... how is the wisp form better than regular ghost form?

kongurous
01-22-2006, 9:16 PM
In your post... you mentioned wisp form being another plus...

so I want to know... how is the wisp form better than regular ghost form?

Wisp goes faster than normal ghost.

Incantrix
01-23-2006, 3:03 AM
Whisp form doesn't seem like that great of an ability. You usually want to avoid dying. The only times I die nowadays is in instances, where I have someone to rez me, or when I'm farming 61 elites and devilsaurs in ungoro, and even then I don't die that much. Particularly at lvl 60, everyone has so many ways of escaping that it's almost always embarrassing to die at lvl 60.

Geno
01-23-2006, 12:54 PM
Whisp form doesn't seem like that great of an ability. You usually want to avoid dying. The only times I die nowadays is in instances, where I have someone to rez me, or when I'm farming 61 elites and devilsaurs in ungoro, and even then I don't die that much. Particularly at lvl 60, everyone has so many ways of escaping that it's almost always embarrassing to die at lvl 60.

When you're lower level, it's going to help out. Expecially when you get new abilities and want to try them out or push the limits farther. Or if you go into an instance with a group and a wipe starts going on, you can release and run back while the fight is going on. What do I mean?

So last night (About 2:00 in the morning. I blame my iffy preformance on that), I'm in the middle of Upper BlackRock Spire (UBRS for reference. It's strange how people still don't know that sometimes >.>) with a group of people. One of two Druids, so I figured "Fifty fifty at any Wildheart that drops," as I want to get the full set. Sure the full thing stinks, but it's kind of my 'goal' at this point to get a full set. *Shrug*

We get all the way up to "The Beast." Of our 15 person group, one drops. Another leaves. So we're 13 strong. Not a problem. I've got my healing within my group (The only five person group), the other Druid has a four person, and then a Priest has the last. So by some act of stupidity, the Warrior in my group decides "Oh, I can tank it! It doesn't look so tough!" and charges in. Great. So now the giant beast is coming, and the Warlock in another group goes "Why not!" And curses it. So now two people are in combat. What happens in PuG? Oh yea... Follow the leader... Everyone ends up in combat, the healers being the last, after thinking "Should we do this?"

My friend, a 57 Rogue messages me with "Why are we doing this again?" He was the only sane one, staying out of combat the longest, but after everyone was in, he shrugged it off, and began pummeling away. Well, my Warrior and a Mage in my group were taking the big beating, drawing the most aggro. They both drop afer I healed them like an insane Priest at level 60 using the Troll's berserker move, while being Innervated... I don't know how I kept them alive as long as I did, but I burnt through a potion, my innervate, and the OTHER Druid's innervate, as his group was taking nothing. Well, they died... And The Beast decided I was a chew toy.

I realized after I died "Noone has SoulStone!" and I set out to try and save us. Darted back as a wisp, getting inside, and as soon as the Priest dropped, I threw a combat res to them. Well, I was right about no Soulstone. However, I couldn't prevent the wipe. Although I got the Priest up, the living members still went at The Beast, but we died at 15%. However, the Priest got right back up, wondering "How did that happen? All the res'ers were dead!" and I told them.

We dropped him two tries later, and I walked away with Finkle's Skinner, as I was the ONLY skinner there, apparently! Woot! I've got to get two more levels to use it, but the group agreed that since I was the only skinner, and the only 300 one to boot, I was entitled rights to is. Rather nice group if you ask me! Even if we did wipe like 4 times... Three being Soulstoned, the last being at The Beast.

In any event, Druids can quickly run back, saving time, and stealthing through mobs that have respawned. I've done this countless times, and trust me... Parties love Driuds who know how to play it smart and safe. You just have to know aggro ranges, who is being ressed, and where every monster is in relation to you. Sure, I didn't 'prevent' the wipe, but I did save everyone from saying "OMFG DONE" afterwards. The Priest didn't jump up (Like a good Priest with a level ?? mob killing his group) until afterwards, and proceeded to res a pair of Pallies, and two tries later (Soulstone wipe the next time. The Beast decided to begin to patrol out to us, and thought our level 55 Hunter was a snack), we walked away with me coming out with the skinner I needed, and everyone else a lot happier ^.^

Yea, that's the moral. Sure, it's not a 'great' talent, but it can be useful!

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

Sikawtic
01-23-2006, 2:20 PM
You're good at storytelling.

Incantrix
01-23-2006, 2:48 PM
I /bow before your wow.

Geno
01-24-2006, 3:54 PM
You're good at storytelling.

Storytelling or not, it helped at least try and save my group. I know my limits, and use every trick at my disposal with a Druid. Expecially in Outdoor instances. Trust me, Entangling roots can be used as crowd control if done properly ;)

~Larry "Geno" Meyers

Sikawtic
01-24-2006, 5:17 PM
I went in WSG yesterday with my lv 18 druid, two or three matches...

I got constant praise for the way I used my entangling roots and bear form... it made me feel good :D (I killed a lvl 19 rogue solo once ^_^)

Overall I got ... 96 hks, and with my lvl 14 experience (lvl 14 druid + pvp = not good) i have a total of 99 hehe.

Sikawtic
01-30-2006, 12:56 AM
Oh and Geno, I'm also going with a clearcasting cat, DPS baby ^_^ (enchanting helps me agility whore too :D)

My planned final specs: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/druids2/talents.html?0140053010000000503202132320215105000 0000000000